Big tree prices

[Mikecutstrees]

I keep not getting big removals and I'm not sure if I'm bidding too high. Bid one today. 38" sugar maple 5' from historic house. Heavily weighted on house side. Large section of decay on backside. Access only from backside due to house. About 70' tall. I wouldn't be able to reach everything with 60' bucket and part of the back side would have to be climbed. Basically no room to lower any brush. I bid it at $3,200 all cleaned up, wood removed and stump low and flat. Caretaker says another company bid it for $2,800 with the stump. I don't think I could do it cheaper. Does this other company have big machines or is it BS? I'm just getting frustrated. .... Mike

 

[Raymond]

Hard to say without looking at it. But if you can't beat his bid you can't.
Alot of guys bids are going down anymore, while we're paying more to operate. Maybe tell'em you could meet them half way with even grinding the stump.

If that don't work then sit back and wait for the next one.

 

[Rftreeman]

When people tell me stuff like that I just tell them ok sorry to waste your time and have a good day. People these days seem to think that tree guys are broke and hungry and can be haggled down to what they feel is a good price or what they "want" to pay.

 

[Slvrmple72]

You would think the art of haggling has died but it has not! Unfortunately, we are bidding our fairest lowest price to do the work and they think it can be done more cheaply! Arrgh! Whatever I think I can do it for I am adding what I think will be the haggling amount when I size up the customer. Sometimes, they don't haggle and I give them a bill under the estimate and still get a nice tip out of the job. Other times they are such a pain to deal with that I don't discount the haggle amount at all! The older women can be the really difficult customers and what with all of the firewood scroungers around cutting easy trees down for free their expectations have gone from incredibly high to outright astounding! This is not a good year to buy a new shiny piece of equipment and expect to have the work to cover its payment unless you plan on chasing storms!

 

[tomtrees58]

are you bizzy if not bid $2500 tom trees we do it all the time make it up next time tom trees

 

[Mitchell]

hours

I bid it at $3,200 all cleaned up, wood removed and stump low and flat.

How many man hours for the Job. Sounds like a high price for my neck of the woods, but the prices are always less here then most places. I find bidding low can keep the pay roll going which is important only if you have regular staff you want to retain. If the guys can live with a few less days of work just take the jobs that pay what you need to make.]

I did a lot of business last year compared to the previous but did not increase my profits. Good for the troops, who regularly made more then me, However I just beat up my equipment and never saw my kids. This year I told the guys I am not bidding low any more so their might not be work full time.

 

[ozzy42]

I think a lot of the severe underbidding is coming from COs that are failing ,and know it . Kinda like putting off the inevitable death of their bussiness.
If they know the finance co is going to come and take their equipment they can afford to do some work a lot cheaper if they got behind,and don't,or can't plan on catching up . As irresponsible as it is,they are putting some cash in their pocket from the right now,and not worrying about tomorrow.
Don't know if this is the case in your example,but I have seen it done.
If it is ,all you can do is hope for the their speedy demise.

 

[ccrider2240]

seriously, sure the technicality comes into play, but if i can do it in a day ill charge it for a day, plus a few more, knowing that the local wannabees will be pitching a tent for 3 days. They dont understand my hourly rate, talk sh** that im so over priced, no its just that what i can do in one day takes my competiton 2 days. hell the more i think about it, do i have an hourly,, i usually just bid it for whats its worth at that time. Does this make sense?:monkey: i think i just confused myself even more.

 

[jar1zx]

i find its better not to come off ur price. if u work cheaper you wont be as happy with the job and you might try 2 cut time with short cuts

now since i said that i have only been talked down on my price 3 times
it will not happen again. in all fairness its not even worth coming down on the price that you set....even 1 dollar

any of yall ever under bid a job???? i have a few times but do the job the best i can. make em happy and dont think of asking for more money

when you give them ur bid it's the same thing as giving them ur word

 

[treeseer]

I keep not getting big removals and I'm not sure if I'm bidding too high. Bid one today. 38" sugar maple 5' from historic house. Heavily weighted on house side. Large section of decay on backside. ....I'm just getting frustrated. .... Mike

More and more competition for removal jobs, that's a reality that will drive everyone down. One option is to sell preservation. Pruning, soil improvement, disease diagnosis and treatment.

If you can corner that niche of the market in your area, work will come to you.

 

[TDunk]

i find its better not to come off ur price. if u work cheaper you wont be as happy with the job and you might try 2 cut time with short cuts

I agree 110%. When i first started out, i under bid a couple jobs and was pissed the whole time. Tried to save time hear and there, but couldn't wait to get done and move on to the next job.

 

[arbor pro]

In instances where word of mouth happens to be how you get most of your work, just remember that one haggler will tell of his successfull haggling experience to all of his haggling friends and family. In other words, don't start the snowball rolling if you don't want it to pick up a few more snowflakes along the way. Soon, everyone will be expecting to haggle with you...

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Quite often companies that specialize in big removals can significantly underbid a trimming company that does the occasional TD.

Yes they are mechanized more, but they also have to experiance to work bigger, subsequently faster then most others.

Having one more man on the crew will also keep things moving faster too. If that one extra "under $100/day" laborer will get you of the property in a day....

Do they sell the same cleanup that you do? Many high end trim companies get so anal about cleanup that they will out-bid themselves.

Can you stagger portions of the operation so that it does not all have to be done right away? I know a number of big tree companies that yard the logs on site so that they can come back on a route and pick up several log piles to control cost.

oops, gotta leave for work

 

[tree MDS]

More and more competition for removal jobs, that's a reality that will drive everyone down. One option is to sell preservation. Pruning, soil improvement, disease diagnosis and treatment.

If you can corner that niche of the market in your area, work will come to you.

I've just lately come to this realization after years of denial.

Everyone wants to do takedowns because they are easy fast money and you can use the equipment to make life easier. Every year more and more hackers pop up looking to do takedowns (not that there's anything wrong with a good takedown), most dont seem to even have a clue what to charge so they ruin the market.

Yep, if you really want to succeed you have to set yourself apart from the others and offer the services you listed above.

 

[Mikecutstrees]

thank you for all of the excellent responses. I think I agree with pretty much everything that people said. I'm not the most mechanized company and someone who owns a crane, skidsteer, log truck,70' bucket etc could do it alot faster and therefore a little cheaper. Also someone might be dying for work, there are a few companies around on their last leg it seems. I'm super busy right now with the ice storm damage from dec. So I'd rather do prunes and simpler takedowns myself. I just wasn't sure why I keep missing out on the big takedowns. I also agree that there is other work out there besides takedowns. My crew is smart and Iv'e been toying with the idea of getting into tree fertilization. Just looked at a 6' dia white oak the other day in a backyard that the homeowner had allowed the excavator to pile debris on the roots. Tree is already in slight decline. Seems like it could definately use a little helping hand. Unfortunate what excavators do. But thats another story. Thanks for the responses , and sorry about the long winded response.... Mike

 

[clearance]

Everyone wants to do takedowns because they are easy fast money

You are so right, easy, and fast, anyone can do any removal, nothing to any of them. Piece of cake. Why even call a pro, bunch of overpriced prima donnas, any homeowner can do it with a ladder and an electric saw.

 

[Dadatwins]

Why would you chase the big removals? Beside the glory of saying 'I did it' I have always found more profit in the smaller get in - get out type jobs. Big monster trees are hard on saws, equipment and manpower. Of course if you have nothing else or you can make the job profitable then go for it, other wise I find the better money makers are always get in and out jobs. JMHO.

 

[Mikecutstrees]

I'm certainly not chasing. Just want to charge a fair price and keep working thats all. Iv'e done a few big trees but seem to be looking at alot of 36"+ trees lately and want to make a profit and give a fair price. Some of them I really don't care one way or another if I get them because they are a big PITA. I was just picking the brains of some people on here who have alot of experience with large removals..... Mike

 

[ozzy42]

Why would you chase the big removals? Beside the glory of saying 'I did it' I have always found more profit in the smaller get in - get out type jobs. Big monster trees are hard on saws, equipment and manpower. Of course if you have nothing else or you can make the job profitable then go for it, other wise I find the better money makers are always get in and out jobs. JMHO.

Oh man .you are so right.We call them zippers in,out,gone.Profit on most of them is usually around 80%or better.
Most 400$ jobs I do cost me around 60-80bucks to complete in a few hours.
Most jobs around 4000 end up costing 1200-1500bucks and take what seems like eternity,you'all do the math.Big jobs SUCK.

 

[Dadatwins]

I'm certainly not chasing. Just want to charge a fair price and keep working thats all. Iv'e done a few big trees but seem to be looking at alot of 36"+ trees lately and want to make a profit and give a fair price. Some of them I really don't care one way or another if I get them because they are a big PITA. I was just picking the brains of some people on here who have alot of experience with large removals..... Mike

One other point about big jobs, I think people will shop price more when it comes to a 3k job as opposed to a $300.00 job. That said, odds are that with more folks bidding someone else will beat your price. Best thing I find is set your price for a fair days pay and stay with it, when you start second guessing yourself you will underbid and find yourself digging a hole that is hard to get out of. Yes tough times call for price adjustments, but this industry has been around for a long time and as long as trees grow, someone will have to take care of them.