ECHO Chainsaws - are they catching on?!

[Michigan Muscle]

Definetly pre Shinny. 650 and 660 very similar.

Thats what I've heard. I did also find out through a buddy of mine that worked for Echo when these 650's were rolling out, that they are 65 cc's, and while they (Echo) won't disclose the Hp ratings, he recalls the 650 EVL's being 4.5 Hp. Anyways - thanks for the follow up. Good info to know.

 

[hiluxxulih]

I am still liking my 600-p but I would rather have the black Echo branded bar instead of the Oregon power match bar that is on it , it had a 24" black Echo branded bar but I wanted a 20" and they just put an Oregon bar on it , I know they are the same bars but I like the black look .

 

[jerrycmorrow]

I am still liking my 600-p but I would rather have the black Echo branded bar instead of the Oregon power match bar that is on it , it had a 24" black Echo branded bar but I wanted a 20" and they just put an Oregon bar on it , I know they are the same bars but I like the black look .

paint it with black and coat it with clearcoat

 

[hiluxxulih]

Another thing I contacted Echo about my saw to inquire if it is the new improved CS600-P and according to Echo the improved models started production in August 2011 and mine is October 2011 build date .

 

[zogger]

Another thing I contacted Echo about my saw to inquire if it is the new improved CS600-P and according to Echo the improved models started production in August 2011 and mine is October 2011 build date .

Did you find out exactly what has been changed? I know they went to a metal handlebar, what else?

 

[Mastermind]

I'm not sure what they have done or if they acknowledged that there was a problem with the carbs, but on the earlier CS600s I've had issues with the low side adjustment. They are very finicky. In order to get good throttle response the low jet must be out too much.....this causes the saw to be too rich on the high side, never clearing out in the cut.

It takes some tweaking of the throttle butterfly to get it right. I've been considering drilling the idle passage a bit oversize.....

 

[hiluxxulih]

Did you find out exactly what has been changed? I know they went to a metal handlebar, what else?

They did not say what the improvements were just when they were entered into production .

 

[hiluxxulih]

I scored me a proper 20" black Echo branded bar on EBay a few days ago

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I scored me a proper 20" black Echo branded bar on EBay a few days ago

What did it sell for?

 

[spike60]

I only read a few posts in this thread. The predictable arguments between the usual antagonists didn't take too long to show up. :msp_sad:

But to answer the OP's actual question, Echos are not catching on and they aren't going to. And that's not a knock on Echo product which has always been decent stuff. Two weeks ago I got to run an old 650 something twin cylinder, and it was a really cool saw. The new saws, like the 600 that you guys are talking about is also a nice item. And most Echo saws in between those two have been fine.

The reality in the saw world, and it's not gonna change, is that Husky and Stihl are the only two brands on the lead lap. They literally own the market. They are usually perceived as competing with each other for top dog status, which in many ways is true. But if you look back over the last 20 years, they have captured market share not so much from each other, but from everyone else who are now left clinging to single digit market share.

One of the things guys on forums such as this can get fooled by is the "this is the saw" false hope. What I mean by that is the thought that a new model from a second tier company is going to be the one that turns the market on it's head and actually moves the needle. The Echo 600 is a fine saw, but there have been other great saws that also held out this false promise. Dolmar 120SI, Olympyk 970. The Dolmar 7900 would be a more recent example. All great saws in and of themselves, but only a small piece of the puzzle needed to gain traction in the saw market.

You take a broad angle look at the size and strength of what Husky and Stihl have going for them and the idea that any other company is going to have any significant impact on them is simply not realistic.

 

[mountainlake]

It will take time but Husky and Stihl cheaply made homeowner saws will hurt thier sales. Wasn't that long ago you couldn't buy cheap saws from either. Steve

 

[spike60]

It will take time but Husky and Stihl cheaply made homeowner saws will hurt thier sales. Wasn't that long ago you couldn't buy cheap saws from either. Steve

Actually, just the opposite is taking place. The pro market is unaffected by the lower priced models that these companies offer. The pro saws from both Husky and Stihl are as good as they've ever been. Guys that run 372's, 562's, MS441's and MS660's could care less what those companies are offering to the homeowners.

But both companies have seen explosive growth in the non-pro markets since they began offering saws at those lower price points. Again, that growth has not come at each other's expense, but from other companies who were trying to compete in the homeowner market.

First they gobbled up the pro market, and then they went out and dominated the homeowner market.

 

[bryanr2]

I only read a few posts in this thread. The predictable arguments between the usual antagonists didn't take too long to show up. :msp_sad:

But to answer the OP's actual question, Echos are not catching on and they aren't going to. And that's not a knock on Echo product which has always been decent stuff. Two weeks ago I got to run an old 650 something twin cylinder, and it was a really cool saw. The new saws, like the 600 that you guys are talking about is also a nice item. And most Echo saws in between those two have been fine.

The reality in the saw world, and it's not gonna change, is that Husky and Stihl are the only two brands on the lead lap. They literally own the market. They are usually perceived as competing with each other for top dog status, which in many ways is true. But if you look back over the last 20 years, they have captured market share not so much from each other, but from everyone else who are now left clinging to single digit market share.

One of the things guys on forums such as this can get fooled by is the "this is the saw" false hope. What I mean by that is the thought that a new model from a second tier company is going to be the one that turns the market on it's head and actually moves the needle. The Echo 600 is a fine saw, but there have been other great saws that also held out this false promise. Dolmar 120SI, Olympyk 970. The Dolmar 7900 would be a more recent example. All great saws in and of themselves, but only a small piece of the puzzle needed to gain traction in the saw market.

You take a broad angle look at the size and strength of what Husky and Stihl have going for them and the idea that any other company is going to have any significant impact on them is simply not realistic.

That is without a doubt, the most sensible thing I have read on here in a long time. Great insight!

 

[mountainlake]

Actually, just the opposite is taking place. The pro market is unaffected by the lower priced models that these companies offer. The pro saws from both Husky and Stihl are as good as they've ever been. Guys that run 372's, 562's, MS441's and MS660's could care less what those companies are offering to the homeowners.

But both companies have seen explosive growth in the non-pro markets since they began offering saws at those lower price points. Again, that growth has not come at each other's expense, but from other companies who were trying to compete in the homeowner market.

First they gobbled up the pro market, and then they went out and dominated the homeowner market.

Agreed the pro market will stay the same but I know quite a few people who don't think much Stihl and Husky homeowner saws anymore which will hurt thier name which got made by selling only high quality saws a few years back. The higher quality saws like Echo, Dolmar ,Efco will bite into the Stihl -Husky homeowner sales which I'd guess is a lot of thier market. It takes a long time to earn a good name and not to long to ruin it with low qualty products, ask Polaris which went from a 75% market share to around 15% by putting out low quality machines. Out on saw jobs I let Husky and Stiihl owners use my CS400 and almost without fail they ask where I got it, how much it cost. Echo , Dolmar and Efco will bite into the Stihl and Husky homeowner market . Steve

 

[hiluxxulih]

What did it sell for?

It was $25 with $11 shipping .

 

[hiluxxulih]

Agreed the pro market will stay the same but I know quite a few people who don't think much Stihl and Husky homeowner saws anymore which will hurt thier name which got made by selling only high quality saws a few years back. The higher quality saws like Echo, Dolmar ,Efco will bite into the Stihl -Husky homeowner sales which I'd guess is a lot of thier market. It takes a long time to earn a good name and not to long to ruin it with low qualty products, ask Polaris which went from a 75% market share to around 15% by putting out low quality machines. Steve

The main reason I bought my Echo is because it seems like I have to say three hail Marys every time I start my last two Stihls a MS250 and MS 362 I finaly got my MS 250 to start yesterday to help cut a stump out of the ground , I am cleaning it and the Echo up now .

 

[mountainlake]

[First they gobbled up the pro market, and then they went out and dominated the homeowner market.[/QUOTE]

They have dominated the homeowner market living off thier name, it won't last putting out low quality saws. I have no respect for a lot of companys that used to be good names . Delta, Powermatic, Maytag, Ingersol Rand just to name a few. Stihl and Husky are headed the same way. Steve

 

[zogger]

I only read a few posts in this thread. The predictable arguments between the usual antagonists didn't take too long to show up. :msp_sad:

But to answer the OP's actual question, Echos are not catching on and they aren't going to. And that's not a knock on Echo product which has always been decent stuff. Two weeks ago I got to run an old 650 something twin cylinder, and it was a really cool saw. The new saws, like the 600 that you guys are talking about is also a nice item. And most Echo saws in between those two have been fine.

The reality in the saw world, and it's not gonna change, is that Husky and Stihl are the only two brands on the lead lap. They literally own the market. They are usually perceived as competing with each other for top dog status, which in many ways is true. But if you look back over the last 20 years, they have captured market share not so much from each other, but from everyone else who are now left clinging to single digit market share.

One of the things guys on forums such as this can get fooled by is the "this is the saw" false hope. What I mean by that is the thought that a new model from a second tier company is going to be the one that turns the market on it's head and actually moves the needle. The Echo 600 is a fine saw, but there have been other great saws that also held out this false promise. Dolmar 120SI, Olympyk 970. The Dolmar 7900 would be a more recent example. All great saws in and of themselves, but only a small piece of the puzzle needed to gain traction in the saw market.

You take a broad angle look at the size and strength of what Husky and Stihl have going for them and the idea that any other company is going to have any significant impact on them is simply not realistic.

You never know in the future though. Look at the rise of the Japanese car companies, etc, say between 1975 and 2000. One generation, things can change. Husky and Stihl dominate *now*, but it isn't carved in stone that will always be the case. Could be ten years from now some unknown Chinese company will bingo to quality control, make their own saw, not a clone, but their own saw, and come in one half the price at both home owner and pro levels.

Not saying it *will* happen, but it's totally within the realm of possibility.

 

[Mastermind]

You never know in the future though. Look at the rise of the Japanese car companies, etc, say between 1975 and 2000. One generation, things can change. Husky and Stihl dominate *now*, but it isn't carved in stone that will always be the case. Could be ten years from now some unknown Chinese company will bingo to quality control, make their own saw, not a clone, but their own saw, and come in one half the price at both home owner and pro levels.

Not saying it *will* happen, but it's totally within the realm of possibility.

Very true. McCulloch was the cat's ass for a good long while......

 

[PJF1313]

Very true. McCulloch was the cat's ass for a good long while......

What brought them down?

The mini-mac's?




Is it like Husky selling to the box stores?

I'd hate to see them die like that!