Engine/Carb Trouble, Didier Wood Splitter

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2coldHere

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Hi all, I'm new here, hoping I can get some help with a 1970's era Didier wood splitter that I picked up recently (VERY used, passed thru many hands it seems) that just can't get to run right.

Anyone have a manual for the engine, carb, and carb linkages?

The splitter is a Didier Model HA19M, Code 8G, Serial 217507. The hydraulic pump is Model 205-2266, Serial D11928. Engine is B&S 5HP. For the life of me I can't find a serial or model number stamped anywhere on the engine, so that's part of my problem: can't look up how the engine is "supposed to be" without knowing the engine & carb type/model.

Symptoms when I first got it: always had to pull out the choke (cylinder-slide type, looks like a Briggs "Pulsa-Jet" type carb) to start it, even when it was hot; the choke won't stay out by itself so I had to hold it out with my left hand while pulling the starter rope with my right hand, sort of an awkward move but there wasn't any other way. Once it started I could push the choke back in and it ran sort of ok. I could see the choke cylinder bouncing in & out while the engine was running and I knew that wasn't right but wasn't sure if it was just because there wasn't any friction anymore to hold the choke cylinder still, or if it was doing it on purpose to suck in more gas when needed (I don't know these kinds of carbs well). Then it started running rough, stalling, and finally didn't want to run at all unless I removed the air cleaner and squirted starter fluid into the carb. I figured it just needed a good cleaning.

I removed the carb and its mounting bracket from the engine, removed it from the gas tank, and found everything was really dirty and the inlet screens were covered with debris. Cleaned the whole carb very well (also cleaned the air filter's foam, and re-oiled the foam afterwards), also cleaned the inside of the gas tank - had to sandblast a couple rusted spots in the tank; very gently cleaned the carb's diaphram and saw it was in good shape, spring seemed to still be good, no tears visible in the diaphram. I re-assembled everything but was confused about all the linkages & springs for the throttle and governor system (that's where I think my problem is; I think it's missing a spring or two, maybe a connecting rod for the governor system, and maybe I put things together wrong?).

New symptoms: still have to pull the choke out to start it, and I have to pull the starter cord maybe 6 or 7 times before it'll start, even when it's hot. Can't get the mixture screw set right: I set it to the default 1-1/2 turns as a starting point; and it does the surge-stall high/low rpm thing where the governor keeps pulling on the throttle, then letting go when it gets to a higher rpm. If I screw the screw in, it smooths out quite a bit but just as it gets to where it's sounding "almost right" it stalls and won't restart until I turn the screw back out a quarter turn or more. When I start from default and screw it out more, the surge-stall thing gets more severe and the engine backfires like crazy.

Any help would be appreciated. The leaves are already falling and it's getting chilly & windy, and I've got a big pile of logs to split before the cold sets in. I don't have the money to take it to a "repair shop" so I'm on my own in diagnosing & fixing it. I rebuild my kids' dirt bike and ATV engines (2 and 4 stroke) and my lawnmower engines and fix everything on my cars except transmissions, so I'm handy enough to fix it; I just need to know what it's supposed to look like, especially the carb linkages to/from the governor system.
 
I hate, I mean really hate that design, I recommend hunting down a used bowl type carb and fitting it to the engine, I've had good luck with the ones off of Found roadside snow blowers for your size engine.
 
Pull the carb off and put a new diaphram in it. They are pretty easy to do, and the parts are cheap. While you are in there, take some carb cleaner to the passages.

Can you take some pics? There should be engine numbers stamped in the flywheel cover IIRC.
 
New carb &/or diaphram?

Walt... the B&S engine on the splitter has a governor system, I think it's mechanical (has a lever that goes inside the crankcase area). Aren't most snowblowers set up with a manual throttle where you set it to a certain speed and leave it there? Will a carb from a non-governed engine work with a woodsplitter; doesn't the splitter need more engine throttle/power as the hydraulic ram needs more power?

sawguy... What does "IIRC" mean? I cleaned the carb and all its passages really well. But I didn't put a diaphram in it, I just re-used the old one after cleaning it gently. I'll probably try that route but will have to take the carb + diaphram to the store with me because I don't have a carb model number to reference it to on the lookup sheet.

Sure could use a manual if anyone has one; at least the page(s) showing the carb and all of its governor hookups & springs & levers and all that stuff.

Thanks for the advice so far.
 
Walt... the B&S engine on the splitter has a governor system, I think it's mechanical (has a lever that goes inside the crankcase area). Aren't most snowblowers set up with a manual throttle where you set it to a certain speed and leave it there? Will a carb from a non-governed engine work with a woodsplitter; doesn't the splitter need more engine throttle/power as the hydraulic ram needs more power?

sawguy... What does "IIRC" mean? I cleaned the carb and all its passages really well. But I didn't put a diaphram in it, I just re-used the old one after cleaning it gently. I'll probably try that route but will have to take the carb + diaphram to the store with me because I don't have a carb model number to reference it to on the lookup sheet.

Sure could use a manual if anyone has one; at least the page(s) showing the carb and all of its governor hookups & springs & levers and all that stuff.

Thanks for the advice so far.

I just went through this trying to figure out my chipper engine. Someone had taken the carb off, and never bothered to put it back together. I bought the chipper cheap, but he didn't give me all the parts.

All of the B&S engines have a governor, but the throttle sets the operating speed. On a splitter, the speed will usually be set with a threaded rod, and left at 2500 RPM or so.

Anyway, here are most of the engine linkage configurations.

13s.gif


5hpBriggslinckagephotos006.jpg



Briggsgovlinkage.jpg



IIRC = If I Recall Correctly. Sorry for the confusion.

Feel free to poke around in my photobucket files. There are some other pictures in there.

http://s625.photobucket.com/albums/tt332/somephotoguy/Chipper/
 
Walt... the B&S engine on the splitter has a governor system, I think it's mechanical (has a lever that goes inside the crankcase area). Aren't most snowblowers set up with a manual throttle where you set it to a certain speed and leave it there? Will a carb from a non-governed engine work with a woodsplitter; doesn't the splitter need more engine throttle/power as the hydraulic ram needs more power?


Yes and no, most splitter engines are ran at a specific RPM with some reliance on the governor, with a few springs and a good pair of pliers almost any governor setup can be made to work. On my old splitter I ran it about 70% max throttle most of the time and had a foot pedal to stomp it to max for the really crappy pieces. As we have discussed in a previous thread, small engines are generally designed to run at or near max RPM.
 
RE: Responses

Sorry for not responding earlier guys; wife had to go into the hospital and I had to drop everything else (she's ok now). Will get to your replies in a couple days; thanks for helping. Still have to get that splitter fixed so I won't be dropping this thread till it runs right....
 
Found Model Number

Sawguy thanks for telling me to look closer; I found the Briggs' engine's model number, Model 130202 Type 0801-03 Code 79062606. Went to the parts store today and bought a new diaphram and a diaphram spring. Hopefully will get to it tomorrow.

Your last diagram looks just like my carb, including the knurled thumb-screw rod sticking straight up vertically to set the speed, and the other linkages look very close. Also has that exact type of pull-out barrel choke.

Related problem: my choke knob seems to be loose, wiggles around and flops in & out when the engine runs. It doesn't have a spring-loaded steel rod like some diagrams show. I saw on another site that this "floppy choke knob" problem is caused simply by a worn-down friction rivet on the bottom of the carb, and all I'd need to do it drill the old rivet out and pop in a new one to give it friction again.

Anyone know if that makes sense?

Once I put the new diaphram in I'll let you know if I get it running smoother. Thanks again.
 
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New Diaphram, Still Not Right

I put in a new diaphram and diaphram spring, cleaned the carb fully again. Still not running right, still does that race/idle/race/idle stuff (surge-stall).

If I hold the throttle still with my finger, instead of letting the spring-loaded governor/lever system control the throttle, then I can get it to run smooth. But as soon as I let all those springs & levers take control, it goes back to its surge-stall thing and the governor lever goes up & down methodically.

When I adjust the speed thumb-screw and the carb mixture screw together I can "almost" get it to run smooth... but then the muffler glows red hot within seconds (too lean?). Can't seem to find the magic point... maybe something else wrong, like valve clearances or something? Or maybe just more carb tinkering needed?

Any more hints?

Could use help on this because I'm paying $60 a face cord for pre-split firewood when I could instead pay $30 if I spilt it myself. Already bought 3 face cord and at that price I'd be better off just using my gas boiler instead.
 
Fixed (pretty much)

Fixed it. Thanks guys for helping. What I needed to do was slow down, take my time, and do things step by step.

I hit my own mind's "reset" button yesterday and started over. Removed the carb, air cleaner, gas tank, linkages, muffler, linkage plates. Spent most of the day carefully disassembling, inspecting, cleaning and repairing/adjusting all the parts.

The carb was still dirty inside even though I'd cleaned it before. This time I did it slowly and right. Also pulled the old choke knob's holding rivet and replaced it with a new pop rivet so it'll stay where I put it. Removed & cleaned the two intake straws (plastic/brass intakes with debris screens) and found the screens "appeared" clean but were coated with "old gas varnish" and restricted the flow. Fixed that and carefully reinstalled them.

Gas tank also had a couple problems. First, there was some rust inside one of the reservoirs for the intake straws and I used chemical rust remover, then cleaned the whole tank inside & out. Then found the carb's bottom plate didn't sit completely flat on top of the tank (warped tank surface) so I carefully flattened the tank top for a good seat.

I cleaned & straightened all the rods & tabs that were part of the throttle & governor linkage. This thing's 32 years old and has been through many hands, and some of the linkage systems were bent. If a tab looked like it should be at 90 degrees but wasn't, well I gently bent it back to 90 degrees; if it looked like it was supposed to be flat & straight but wasn't, I flattened & straightened it. If a mechanical sliding system was loose or sloppy or didn't slide well, I tapped/bent/adjusted it till it "looked right".

I took my time putting it all back together and tried to make sure everything seemed to "make sense". I gave it a few hours to sit (for my brain to rest) and then went back out and double-checked everything; found I'd forgotten to tighten a couple bolts, etc. Re-tweaked and re-checked everything and when I finally felt like everything looked as it should, I put gas in the tank and drizzled some in the carb. Pulled the choke knob out, pulled the recoil starter a few times, and she fired right up, pretty smoothly.

I had to adjust the mixture screw a bit here and there as I set the speed control to different settings but finally found the sweet spot where it runs right at all RPMs. Even "smells right" with the exhaust.

It has a little trouble starting when cold, but I'll work on that as a minor issue.

I was reminded of being a young teen and reading that book "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance", where the author was talking about the assembly instructions that he saw included with a Japanese bicycle that read something like, "Assembly of Japanese Bicycle require great peace of mind."

That's what I'd needed all along: slow down, take my time, ask, listen, read and think; and THEN go about fixing the problem. My rush to split all that wood out back was causing me to rush to fix a 32 year old engine that was hanging on by a thread as it was and needed a good TLC once-over....

Thanks again guys for the advice & input. You were each right with your advice; and the diagrams were really helpful.

Now to start troubleshooting the lack of a detent in the hydraulic pump's lever problem (whole different issue, haven't started that yet).
 
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