Foresters: What's Your Job Really Like?

[slowp]

If you bake cookies and bribe the loggers, they will sometimes promise and keep the promise not to harass the extremely young men who want to see if they want to work as foresters and are out for the day following along. Cookies also encourage good work, and act as a reward for pulling the forester's pickup out of the snowy or muddy or dry ditch.

One of the best parts of working on the logging end is that you meet some unique and eccentric characters.
Those are getting to be rare and endangered.

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[Matt59]

Ask and ye shall receive.

You've had some great advice here from people who know what they're talking about. Grab that education while you can.

And when you become a forester remember to treat the loggers nicely. They deserve it.

I admit I kinda envy you guys. Not many chances to do anything that resembles logging over here, about 40 miles from the White House! I fired up the saw today and cut a chunk out of an an big old fallen tree, though. I was getting tired of having to set my bow and target block down and slide over the log on my way out to the power lines to shoot. And I did fell a few black birch and buck and limb a big cherry over spring break, on family land in NY.
Thanks to everyone for the advice. I've found a lot of good information on here lately and I can tell the folks here really know what they're talking about.

 

[HuskStihl]

That's LOGGERS...foresters have croissants and cappuchino at some place with real linen tablecloths and snooty waiters.



I'll go stand in the corner now, with my Donettos and 7-11 coffee, and try to look contrite.

I don't know Bob personally, but "contrite" sounds just about right:biggrin:
The foresters taking the time to share their experiences with our young Marine makes me proud to be an AS member.

 

[mitch95100]

I got my ears peeled and my mouth zipped... im looking at this field also, ill be lurking

Sent from me to you using my fingers

 

[StihlKiwi]

Some good advice in this thread

As a forester I'll say my job's awesome. I get to spend plenty of time out in the bush (probably spent ~3 days in the office the past 2 weeks) and there's plenty of variety in the job. Can't complain about the ute and phone that come with the job either, although the pager and Easter standby aren't so flash.

 

[Gologit]

Thanks to everyone for the advice. I've found a lot of good information on here lately and I can tell the folks here really know what they're talking about.

OlympicYJ would be a good one to listen to also. He's going through forestry school right now and he could give you some insight about that.

 

[hardpan]

Matt
I sense you are not 100% dedicated to the school route. I am not a forester, nor have I ever known one but if I had it to do over I would likely consider that direction as for the past 50 years it is the place I most want to be and work. I was an engineering student but did not finish because I needed money, a job. That was 40 years ago and since then I have passed through many different, sometimes miserable jobs and made some mistakes I'm ashamed of but the biggest mistake of my life was not finishing school. For you today, school is job 1. Don't find yourself someday looking for a time machine.

 

[slowp]

The Forest Service has a program for students. The acronym changes, so I won't try to do it. Maybe they changed and call it an internship? You might want to check on it. I don't know if they pay any tuition, but they will hire you during the summers and then you are kind of sort of guaranteed a permanent position somewhere--you won't have a choice of the location.

You'll also get veteran hiring preference.

However, the Forest Service is a HUGE bureauocracy, with all the good and the bad that comes with that.

 

[Matt59]

Matt
I sense you are not 100% dedicated to the school route. I am not a forester, nor have I ever known one but if I had it to do over I would likely consider that direction as for the past 50 years it is the place I most want to be and work. I was an engineering student but did not finish because I needed money, a job. That was 40 years ago and since then I have passed through many different, sometimes miserable jobs and made some mistakes I'm ashamed of but the biggest mistake of my life was not finishing school. For you today, school is job 1. Don't find yourself someday looking for a time machine.

I understand. I'm not quitting. I do have to remind myself, when I start wishing I could go out and work instead of go to school, that school is prep for my future and if I quit I'm just setting myself up for failure.

 

[Matt59]

The Forest Service has a program for students. The acronym changes, so I won't try to do it. Maybe they changed and call it an internship? You might want to check on it. I don't know if they pay any tuition, but they will hire you during the summers and then you are kind of sort of guaranteed a permanent position somewhere--you won't have a choice of the location.

You'll also get veteran hiring preference.

However, the Forest Service is a HUGE bureauocracy, with all the good and the bad that comes with that.

I applied for a temporary Forestry Technician (Trails) job in NC for the summer. This was about 2 months ago, on usajobs.gov. The Forest Service recieved my application, resume, and the documents I had to send in for claiming veteran's preferance, but I haven't heard anything since then. I'm guessing that the FS is cutting a lot of temp/seasonal jobs due to budget cuts and that may affect my chance of getting hired.

But, do you think it would be a good idea to contact the FS or the actual park I applied to work in, to at least show that I care about getting the job or to get my name in there?
I'm aware of the basics of the Federal hiring process vs. private sector hiring process. If I don't get this job, it's not a big deal; I've applied to several more non-government jobs. It would be good to get a little experience working with the FS though.

 

[Gologit]

I understand. I'm not quitting. I do have to remind myself, when I start wishing I could go out and work instead of go to school, that school is prep for my future and if I quit I'm just setting myself up for failure.

Well, maybe not failure, but your choices will sure be limited without an education. You're going about it the right way.

Without an education you might get stuck with being a logger. I tried going to school after I got out of the Army but I had kids to feed and there was plenty of work for a faller if you knew what you were doing.

Most of the guys I started out with were either dead or crippled by the time they were in their fifties. Logging is very unforgiving. Take a look around, you see a lot more old and active foresters than you do old and active loggers.

I liked logging and I still do but if I had it to do all over again...well, I'll spare you any more "old guy lectures".

Best of luck to you.

 

[Matt59]

Well, maybe not failure, but your choices will sure be limited without an education. You're going about it the right way.

Without an education you might get stuck with being a logger. I tried going to school after I got out of the Army but I had kids to feed and there was plenty of work for a faller if you knew what you were doing.

Most of the guys I started out with were either dead or crippled by the time they were in their fifties. Logging is very unforgiving. Take a look around, you see a lot more old and active foresters than you do old and active loggers.

I liked logging and I still do but if I had it to do all over again...well, I'll spare you any more "old guy lectures".

Best of luck to you.

Failure wasn't the right word. Limited, as you put it, is right.

I don't mind the "old guy lectures." I'm only 23, but I like to think that I'm at least smart enough to listen to the "old guys" and learn from their experience and advice. I'm still full of p*ss and vinegar and a bit hard headed but I'm learning to think about the future instead of the right now.

Thanks again for all the advice in this thread. This has been really helpful and has helped me recharge and look at school differently, too.
Anyway, I'm off to class now--Natural Science of the Chesepeake Bay, and Advanced Framing tonight (building rooves tonight!).

 

[stltreedr]

From the utility forester side

You will spend less time enjoying the great outdoors than you think, and more time behind the desk polishing budget numbers, filling out reports, talking to the boss, customers, contractors.
I have been working for the utility for 10 years now. I'm sure it varies from place to place, but we take care of all aspects of maintaining utiity ROW's...Except for the part of actually getting your hands dirty. It sounds to me like you want to actually WORK. I started my own business for that part, work at the utility to pay the bills.

It's a good thing to be over educated...because you won't be young forever. I see some of these guys retiring at 60 from working in trees, and they are all but shot.

Being the first in my family to earn a degree, I am a huge advocate of higher education, do as much as you can and then go back for more. You will never regret earning a degree and noone can take it from you.

 

[OlympicYJ]

First off. Thank you for your service!!!

Bob thanks for the kudos, I'm a bit late to the party so most of what I'm gonna be contributing are some probably not so hilarious quips and observations as allot of the major stuff has been covered.

That's LOGGERS...foresters have croissants and cappuchino at some place with real linen tablecloths and snooty waiters.


I'll go stand in the corner now, with my Donettos and 7-11 coffee, and try to look contrite.

Hey 7-11 works but Safeway has better selection.... I won't have the luxury of any of that as I found out yesterday I will be in Beaver just north of Forks instead of Port Angeles. Oh well I'm still happy and less distractions to blow money on. Be right by the mill/office on Lake Pleasant :msp_biggrin:

ever have a logger burger ?

Yupp, High School had the logger burger and I've sampled a few logger burgers from other places around.... Camp 18 is the Shizzle...

If you bake cookies and bribe the loggers, they will sometimes promise and keep the promise not to harass the extremely young men who want to see if they want to work as foresters and are out for the day following along. Cookies also encourage good work, and act as a reward for pulling the forester's pickup out of the snowy or muddy or dry ditch.

One of the best parts of working on the logging end is that you meet some unique and eccentric characters.
Those are getting to be rare and endangered.

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Snoose works good too! And you don't have to chew either. Lol If you fight fire Buy many logs of chew and sell it by the can for triple the amount or more. Guys gotta have their fix on a fire and never bring enough so my buddies tell me.

Slowp is right though. If you're working with loggers you have to earn their respect. This doesn't mean through bribery (although cookies would be awesome, hell they could prob bribe me with cookies if they screwed up a log) but just doing your job fairly and humbly as a young guy will get that respect.

Ok so for school. If you go the two year route and you know which 4yr you want to go to. Take classes that you know will transfer. Also take your Biology (at least first class for second you should really go with botony which may only be able to get at the 4yr), Chem, Physics, Math, and English. Get the AA as usually if you just transfer with credits you will still have to do a bunch of BS classes at the 4yr. Get it out of the way in CC by getting an AA and that should meet the core requirements of the 4yr degree. Sometimes if you just transfer individual credits they won't except them as equivilant except fo higher level science classes like chem. So by getting the AA they accept the whole thing. Then by having all the bio and chem and such as extra with your AA you will be going to strait degree specific courses. This is ultimately cheaper and quicker/easier in the long run.

Also here's a tip. Do a minor in a related field. This can help broaden the scope of jobs you qualify for or like me make you even more qualified for a specific one. I'm getting a BS in Forest Resources with a minor in Forest Operations. I wan't to work specifically as an operations forester so this is why I took this route. Folks like madhatte are generalists. Meaning they do it all. Folks like slowp and I are more specialized and fulfill a certain niche job. The different systems have their merits and downfalls that I won't get into but I will say go general on your education until you either gain the experience to know what specialty you may want to move towards or until you get your degree and start working and then discover your niche... everyone has one even if they are a generalist.

Oh and do internships!!! Experience before you finish school is key!

My 2 cent's if someone mentioned something I just did I apologize. I sort of just sped read through the thread.

Good luck and stick with it. I hear ya on getting tired of school. I'm burnt out and senioritis is kicking in even though I have a yr and a semester left. lol

Best wishes,

Wes

Oh and stick around. Lot's of good knowledge to be had here!!

 

[madhatte]

Snoose works good too! And you don't have to chew either. Lol If you fight fire Buy many logs of chew and sell it by the can for triple the amount or more. Guys gotta have their fix on a fire and never bring enough so my buddies tell me.

100% solid advice; worked on the boat, too, for the same reasons.

So by getting the AA they accept the whole thing. Then by having all the bio and chem and such as extra with your AA you will be going to strait degree specific courses. This is ultimately cheaper and quicker/easier in the long run.

That's really what I meant to say; thanks for the clarification. This is by far the most cost-effective way I know of to get an education that will serve you in the woods.

Also here's a tip. Do a minor in a related field.

Now, as a Generalist (can't argue with that term at all), I have to recommend the exact opposite. I did my minor in Photography. Turns out an Arts background has helped me quite a lot -- my maps, especially, are much more useful than many made by others I work with. Simple, fundamental stuff like the Color Wheel will not generally be addressed in a Science or Technology curriculum. It's very important in communication. My Navy experience in Engineering has also been useful -- working with pumps and valves is pretty easy step-by-step, but understanding systems schematically means learning new systems is much easier. My training has been so diverse that it wouldn't make sense as an actual career path, but has worked well for me, even if only by dumb luck. Also, don't discount the importance of hobbies. They serve a bunch of functions, but the two most important, I think, are these: they give you an alternate world to live in when you're not at work, which helps keep things from getting tedious, and they can occasionally offer supplementary skills that come in handy at unexpected times. Follow your instincts -- you know yourself best.

Oh and do internships!!! Experience before you finish school is key!

ABSOLUTELY. I did an internship with Weyerhaeuser in '95 which really solidified my idea that "The Woods" was where I wanted to work. I hadn't figured out exactly which agency or role I wanted to pursue, but it's rare for anybody to know that before they actually "get there".

 

[wowzers]

I'll respond a little later but my path so far has been Marines>TechSchool>Park Service>Four Year School>Logger>Industry Forester.

 

[OlympicYJ]

You are right nate! I should have said the minor doesn't have to be related but something that could be applicable to your career. I thought about using you as an example as to your niche is def GIS and related areas, or that's what it seems lol

Your experience (which internships get you and early career experience) defines your career later in life. I don't know if that's the best way to articulate it but what hatte has said is basically the same.

I don't know if anyone has mentioned but forester duties as far as generalists and silvicutural foresters changes with the seasons as there are projects that go by season. Slash burning, planting, roadside spray, etc. Working as a specialist it tends to be the same over and over sometimes and catastrophic events such as heavy rain events will liven things up because your in oh shate mode trying to minimize sediment delivery. Or any applicable oh shate moment. lol

I hear ya on the internship thing. I knew I wanted to work in forestry but doing my first internship solidified it 100% and after that I was able to identify where I wanted to specialize in.

Wes

 

[dhskier2]

The Forest Service has a program for students. The acronym changes, so I won't try to do it. Maybe they changed and call it an internship? You might want to check on it. I don't know if they pay any tuition, but they will hire you during the summers and then you are kind of sort of guaranteed a permanent position somewhere--you won't have a choice of the location.

Gone are SCEP, STEP, & HEP-C... Now it's just Pathways. And you can look for positions on USAjobs by adding "pathways" as a keyword to your search options.

 

[Matt59]

Wowzers- Looking forward to hearing from you. I have a few more vet friends in college with the same interests as me. Every time we get to having a few beers, the conversation always gets to "what job would you do right now if you weren't in school?" Seems like roughneck, logger, and bounty hunter always come up. A while ago I thought I thought about getting into a carpentry apprenticeship, but decided to take a few classes at CC to learn some skills instead. A few credits count as my elective, the others may not count for anything when I transfer and it may 'waste' GI Bill tuition, but I've had a real good time learning and building, and it breaks up the monotony of the class schedule.

Wow. Lots of good information here.
I'm on track for the Gen.Ed AA right now but will sit down with an advsior before I actually declare a major next year. I haven't even thought about a minor yet but will definitely keep that in mind. Internships seem to be important across the board for any college grad, too.
As far as what specialty I want, I'll keep my eyes and ears open and listen to you all talk about your different jobs to give me an idea about what I might like to do.

By the way, all this talk about dip makes me want to crack open a can of fresh cope but I quit that little while ago and can't bear to get off the wagon!

 

[madhatte]

Gone are SCEP, STEP, & HEP-C

We hired 80% of our seasonal crew through STEP the last 3 years. This year, yeah, it's pretty sketchy, but don't declare STEP "down for the count" just yet. It's a good program, a proven performer, and may survive.