Frustrated!!

[Local # 17 T.T.]

Hello all. I've been a tree trimmer for approximately 8-9 years. I started in line clearance, as a ground man and worked my way up to becoming a journeyman card holder. I was laid off a couple years ago by Asplundh and was employed by Davey for a short time last year, but the drive was killing me. So I went in to business for myself. I got my DBA, Tax I.D # and liability insurance, plus a ford f-250 pick up w a homemade box and a old style fast feed chipper. I normally canvas a neighborhood with professionally made flyers, trying to avoid directly soliciting people, unless I see something obvious and leave it up to people to call for an estimate if their interested. I have a very low percentage of people that do call in for estimates for the amount of time and flyering, but I have just looked at it as getting my name out there and letting my work speak for itself. The people that do call only care about one thing and thats the price. They don't care to much about your qualifications or anything else, just the price and if I try to explain anything after quoting that price, they don't seem to be interested. I've also noticed that if I don't sell the job on the spot that seems to be my only chance. If I try to contact them, I end up leaving a message on the machine or if I do contact them, they are almost insulted and give me a line of b.s. I understand thats part of selling, is overcoming objections, but I wonder if I played the same lying, double-talking, cheating, swindling game the possible customer plays, I'd be on the news and out of what business I do get. I try to bid fair and within the customers budget. I do good work, I am safe and mindful of peoples property and I do an excellent clean up. I do try to be polite and sociable with the customer, but I do have a job to do and that won't get done, standing around talking. As it sits today, I have noticed a steady decrease in business since mid-August, my chipper broke down last week and I am struggling to not lose everything I own. I am interested in any ideas, suggestions or advise you can offer me. Thanks

Mike

 

[Bigus Termitius]

What's up with the chipper?

You know things get gradually slower, that's why we make hay while the sun shines.

My feeling is that if you're fixing to lose it all, you've been underbidding just a little perhaps.

I've noticed the same thing with potential customers and I'm glad not to bother with them ever again.

My advice...don't give up...it's obviously something you love. Take a winter job, fix the chipper, rethink your game plan, and hit it fresh in the spring. Maybe start out working weekends until you're booked enough to pull off a full time job. Stick with the whole workmanship is your signature approach and you will make it.

I'm working through this winter, thankfully, but by next winter I plan to have a plow on a one ton dump and a bobcat to get me moving some snow if things get thin.

Sorry to hear about the whole Asplundh/Davey/union journeyman thing.

 

[Rftreeman]

What's up with the chipper?

You know things get gradually slower, that's why we make hay while the sun shines.

My feeling is that if you're fixing to lose it all, you've been underbidding just a little perhaps.

I've noticed the same thing with potential customers and I'm glad not to bother with them ever again.

My advice...don't give up...it's obviously something you love. Take a winter job, fix the chipper, rethink your game plan, and hit it fresh in the spring. Maybe start out working weekends until you're booked enough to pull off a full time job. Stick with the whole workmanship is your signature approach and you will make it.

I'm working through this winter, thankfully, but by next winter I plan to have a plow on a one ton dump and a bobcat to get me moving some snow if things get thin.

Sorry to hear about the whole Asplundh/Davey/union journeyman thing.

I couldn't agree more....

I feel your pain on the being laid off after many years of good service, just hang in there and stay at it get your chipper fixed and don't give up but don't expect to get rich very soon either.....

 

[teamtree]

When I first started out on my own I failed miserably at direct selling (selling to someone who has not asked you sell them something). Getting your name out and what you can do is the main thing. Let them come to you. It is hard sitting there waiting for it to happen. Telling a customer there tree needs to be removed or trimmed without them calling you is not going to get you much work. Hell, telling them you will grind the big stump in their yard for $20 will probably not work.

I looked for the toughest or worst jobs to do and we did some of the dumbest things people asked us to do but we wanted to show our work ethic and that helped out.

Stay after it and keep your eyes open and keep spreading the word, and when someone needs some work, they will likely give you a call, on their time schedule, not yours.

 

[lxt]

hey mike, one thing you have to remember is that everyone doing this work is the best, just ask them! So.... the customer is hearing a line of BS too.

when I went on my own I found that I had to take a big job for less & bid lower than the other guys, once my Rep got around as being Good!!! price didnt matter anymore, it still does to some & always will but my clientel has grown greatly & now its people who care about quality!!!

It will take about 2yrs or more to prove yourself & you will always be underbid by some newbe idiot that has no biz in the tree biz, if you are about to lose it all then you jumped out to soon!! hang in there & keep pluggin away, if its meant to be it will happen!!


LXT..........

 

[capetrees]

At this point, with the economy as it is and your location in Michigan, you're getting the brunt of it. I would start thinking on mother nature to help out. Keep your name out there for work after heavy storms and storm cleanup. Talk to the power companies, municipalities and police departments around the area to give your name out to those they can't service. Also, diversify. Get a snow plow on your truck and again, hope for mother nature to help out. Don't depend on it though. I've always tried to keep my self diversified and it's worked out for the past 20 years. Tree work is only part of what I do for an income and some of it is seasonal.

Good luck!

 

[Treetom]

Pressure on in Michigan

I feel ya, Local. Things really slowed down here in MI for me, too, around mid-November. You have been in business long enough to have established some clients, though: one of the cheapest things you can do to start drumming up business is to make phone calls. Or offer your skills to another tree service until things pick up. And talk to your fellow tree "brothers"--you may even have to borrow their chipper. All these suggestions have worked for me.

 

[pbtree]

What's up with the chipper?

You know things get gradually slower, that's why we make hay while the sun shines.

My feeling is that if you're fixing to lose it all, you've been underbidding just a little perhaps.

I've noticed the same thing with potential customers and I'm glad not to bother with them ever again.

My advice...don't give up...it's obviously something you love. Take a winter job, fix the chipper, rethink your game plan, and hit it fresh in the spring. Maybe start out working weekends until you're booked enough to pull off a full time job. Stick with the whole workmanship is your signature approach and you will make it.

I'm working through this winter, thankfully, but by next winter I plan to have a plow on a one ton dump and a bobcat to get me moving some snow if things get thin.

Sorry to hear about the whole Asplundh/Davey/union journeyman thing.

Sound wisdom....

 

[Mikecutstrees]

unfortunately it sounds like you have an image problem. Saying that you do quality work and being able to do great work is one thing. People may not believe it, Many small companies struggle with this problem. You need to look as proffesional as possible. People often think that the most professional and best companies are the companies with the new nice clean equipment. When you show up with an older truck with a homemade box on the back to many it says unproffesional hack. This can be a big hurdle to get over when first starting out. Try to do estimates and dress nice, a shirt with the company name on it will help alot. So will clean vehicles. I struggle with these image problems alot. Also word of mouth referalls will help alot. Keep doing quality work the word will get out. Best of luck. Mike

 

[lxt]

that shiny, new equipment...look im professional because of such is BS. Look.. my dump & chipper are the work horses of the operation, they`re old but well kept.

where im at, you go out dressed nice bidding work most people think you will be too expensive, The main reason I can out do most competition in my area?? is my equipment is paid for!! Jim, Bob & Bill went out & bought lots of shiney new/newer equipment, well Now the economy is kickin them in the but & they need to make payments!!! Good luck boys!!

I have had several calls this year from competitors selling equipment, 28k stumper, vermeer chipper, 5ton dump(s), etc... they either bought it just starting out or thought they would add onto their current biz operation...well it didnt work!! problem I see is some companies trying to get too big too soon & newbies without a business clue!!


LXT............

 

[Rftreeman]

that shiny, new equipment...look im professional because of such is BS. Look.. my dump & chipper are the work horses of the operation, they`re old but well kept.

where im at, you go out dressed nice bidding work most people think you will be too expensive, The main reason I can out do most competition in my area?? is my equipment is paid for!! Jim, Bob & Bill went out & bought lots of shiney new/newer equipment, well Now the economy is kickin them in the but & they need to make payments!!! Good luck boys!!

I have had several calls this year from competitors selling equipment, 28k stumper, vermeer chipper, 5ton dump(s), etc... they either bought it just starting out or thought they would add onto their current biz operation...well it didnt work!! problem I see is some companies trying to get too big too soon & newbies without a business clue!!


LXT............

yeah, what he said..............new and shiny means to me, higher price to pay for new and shiny, old paid for and shiny means better price and more work for me plus ain't nobody taking it away from me.

 

[Mikecutstrees]

I agree

Yes, getting too big too soon or not having a business clue will quickly kill a business. All I'm saying is that SOME people..... not all, will equate the quality of your work with how you and your equipment look. But everyone has their own opinion, and that is the great thing, you can hear them all and deceide which works for you..... Mike

 

[John464]

All I'm saying is that SOME people..... not all, will equate the quality of your work with how you and your equipment look.

New trucks, new equipment. Crews with matching uniforms. People associate that with quality. It's a trait of human perception to form an opinion based on a viewpoint. It's how our brains work, subconsciously we all do it.


However, the main reason to buy new trucks and equipment shouldnt be so you can influence customers. It should be so that you can minimize repairs/dowtime, increase safety and production, an add tax write-offs.

Each business and market is different.

 

[mckeetree]

New trucks, new equipment. Crews with matching uniforms. People associate that with quality. It's a trait of human perception to form an opinion based on a viewpoint. It's how our brains work, subconsciously we all do it.


However, the main reason to buy new trucks and equipment shouldnt be so you can influence customers. It should be so that you can minimize repairs/dowtime, increase safety and production, an add tax write-offs.

Each business and market is different.

You are exactly right.

 

[Slvrmple72]

Hang in there! A winter job ( if you can find one! ) may not be a bad idea. Being professional with customers helps but don't be surprised that they don't care for you soliciting business. When you do that give them something in writing and write down a note for yourself! I just got a call from a bid I gave over two months ago! Wrote it on the back of my business card for a cleanup of the big pieces, stump ground out, and chips hauled off of an unfinished tree job. My note said: wifey wears the pants husband wouldn't commit to a good price $225 JOB $150 Stump and chips only Name and address.
You can guess who called me! She said that the neighbors wanted the firewood and it was only the stump and chips she was concerned about now.

 

[Local # 17 T.T.]

The chipper is a whole different animal. I bought it for three hundred bucks and I probably got three grand or more in to it. It seems to break down every other job or so and I end up doing that job, plus others to get it fixed. I, unfortunately haven't done my own repairs, so taking it to a shop can get costly, but i have to keep going to pay my bills and survive. The last break down was a shaft that runs thru the bell housing, clutch and motor. It actually sheared in half and it had to be welded because parts are obsolete. I almost have that balance paid off until last week when I believe the throw-out bearing went right after the last piece of brush went thru.

As far as bidding jobs go, I kinda go by gut feeling, my experience, obstacles on the ground and what has to be hauled away, but like alot of you I bid to get the job and stay working. Thanks for the feedback..

Mike

 

[capetrees]

Compare what you pay monthly or even yearly divided by 12 and if its more than a monthly payment on another new/used chipper, its time to move forward. The machine will continue to to get older and more obsolete and that means more down time. I looked into a company out in that area, Landmark Machinery, and they seem to have really nice equipment at reasonable prices, mostly used equipment. look them up to see what they can do for you. They probably will give you a good trade amount toward another machine, as obsolete as yours is. Yes, more payments but much less down time.

 

[capetrees]

http://www.landmarkmachinery.com/

 

[md_tree_dood]

It's funny that people question new and shiny when most business comes from people seeing your truck on the road or at a job and then calling the number on the side.

 

[Rftreeman]

It's funny that people question new and shiny when most business comes from people seeing your truck on the road or at a job and then calling the number on the side.

not questioning new at all, just stating that used, paid for & shiny works just as well, you don't need brand new stuff to look good all you need to do is make what you have look good and make yourself look good and most of my business comes from craigslist, word of mouth or a walk up, very rarely do I get a call from my trucks.