blis
Addicted to ArboristSite
taken from 353´s manual, 3,1/3,2 (front/back) are the vibration levels... now look at other manufactures values and it should be clear that huskies vibration levels are significantly lower than others...
Husky 353 or 346XP
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SawTroll
Information Collector
Jonsered levels are about the same, for some odd reason.....:biggrinbounce2: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:blis said:
B_Turner
Addicted to ArboristSite
blis said:
I have, and they are great. But what I am focusing on is saws in the 460 and 7900 class as I seldom have a saw in wood less than maybe 18 inches true diameter.
And for the numbers to say the 660 (another great saw I bought new and love and use often) is smoother than my 7900 would be obviously in error to anyone that runs both side by side.
I am by no means a dolmar zealot, just reporting my experience in owning a 7900. Pretty darn sweet motor and considerably smoother than any 460 I have run. But I really like the 460 aside from the vibration level and can see why folks love them. I have almost bought one several times, but now that I have run the 7900 I would feel the 460 is a step back in terms of comfort and performance. I think it's probably a more rugged saw, though.
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Freakingstang
Doctor Freakinstein
Monkeyhanger said:
Ahh, another one that knows all because he read it somewhere on the interent.
You think the 460 has good vibes? I'm really surprised Saw troll didn't eat that statement for breakfast, lunch or whatever meal time it is up yonder.
The 440/460/660 are the oldest form of antivibe, rubber mounts with no spring dampners.....
Just goes to show, that you haven't ran a dolmar. the 460 feels like a jack hammer compared to the other saws in it's class. The 385xp and the 7900 are both more precision and smoother on the operator, not to mention more power to go with it.
All i can say is to get some trigger time before spouting off at the mouth. I will bet money that 90-95% of the poeple that switch from stihls 044/046/660 to the 7900 will not argue about the vibration levels, yet the book readers seem to know what is best....
If the 460 is so great on vibes, why did they change the 441 to spring dampners to reduce the vibes????
manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
SawTroll said:
Yes Husky is doing there best to keep up with Jonsered..
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manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
Come on now, These numbers are not something that Monkeyhanger made up this are the facts.Freakingstang said:
Maybe its because the 460 does so well is because the engine is a more balanced then you think. and I for that matter.
Monkeyhanger
ArboristSite Guru
Freakingstang said:
Hi,
did I say something particular to warrant your insults? I got most of my information from the manufacturers handbooks. You do know what a handbook is don't you?
I was also not "spouting off" but rather trying to keep bias out of things and maybe get behind the claims of some manufacturers. Is that wrong?
As for "trigger time" I have been using chainsaws since 1987 when I first had a Pioneer 650 thrown into my hands. Does that qualify as "trigger time" in your world or am I still just a beginner "spouting off"?
I don't know what rattled you up so bad as I had no intentions of pi+++++ on your Dolmar or having a bash at you personally.
Whatever.
Bye
PS by the way Solo saws have steel springs too and also (according to their own figures) the worst vibe levels in the chainsaw market today!
Another thing Freakingstang you were about 7 years old when I was cutting trees with the Pioneer! Talk about spouting off...
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SawTroll
Information Collector
Maybe, but you are again guilty of ignoring the dampening effects of the anti-vibe systems, which are way different on those models....:greenchainsaw:Monkeyhanger said:
Monkeyhanger
ArboristSite Guru
SawTroll said:
Hi Sawtroll,
do you mean that the vibes may be "less agressive" and feel softer even if that doesn't change the actual levels themselves?
Interesting point which I admit to not having taken into consideration. So the "peaks and troughs" of the vibes may be less peaky and feel softer as a result. That's a good point but does it make a difference with respect to the physical/medical effects. The law makers here don't think it does but I can see how that can lead to the saw feeling as though it has lower vibes because of it.
Thanks for that Sawtroll!
Bye
manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
flying off the handle
Now maybe I am confused, but are the vibration effect being taking off the front and rear handles, So that would include the springs or rubber mounts
Now maybe I am confused, but are the vibration effect being taking off the front and rear handles, So that would include the springs or rubber mounts
Freakingstang
Doctor Freakinstein
Monkeyhanger said:
Actually I was eight in 1987. big deal. The amount of hours i have on multiple saws and comparing them to yours is like who has a bigger ****, neither of which helps either of us or is relavant.
Trigger time on the particular units you are ?????ing about, is what i was reffering to. Just like the guy that ?????es about the 5100 and has never run one.
The fact that the 7900 is light years ahead of the 460 and you want to talk about how bad it sucks becuase you heard from your brothers' uncle's sister that it wasn't that great.
Age, who cares about age. obviously in 1987 you picked the best saw made then too, right?
. A saw is a tool that gets used to do production work. one that doesn't work well, doesn't get much done.
If you had "trigger' time on the 7900, you would see the differences in the vibes. I commend you for being able to run a 460 for four hours straight with no fatigue. i have had and still own a couple 046's and one 460. It isn't like I heard from the neighbor that they weren't 100% perfect. Don't get me wrong the 460 is a great saw and many people have them, but to compare something that you haven't ran in your own hands and bad mouth it is very hypocritical.
i have many saws, and could honestly care whoruns what, although I like to commend Dolmar where i can for their extremely running smooth saws.
but to talk about how bad the vibes are on a saw that you haven't run is pointless
B_Turner said:
Like i said earlier, Monkey dood, get some trigger time on the 7900 and report back to how great the 460 is on vibes. b Turner has obviously ran quite a few saws, and i agree with this statement 100%.
As i said earlier, the 460 is not a bad saw, but trying to compare vibes on the 20 year old design saw (regardless of what the #;s say) to a newer, smoother, more powerful saw is like picking on the fat kid in school.
blis
Addicted to ArboristSite
manual said:
one could assume were talking about the actual vibrations that reach handles since it says measured from rear/front handle...
but, i think what sawtroll is trying to say that the actual frequencies of vibrations may be different, therefore feel different..
Monkeyhanger
ArboristSite Guru
manual said:
Hi,
yes the vibes are measured off/at/on the handles but maybe the steel and rubber dampers have slightly different characteristics? That won't change the absolute values but may change the feel of them if Sawtroll is correct.
Bye
Freakingstang
Doctor Freakinstein
SawTroll said:
That is a very good point. Maybe that is where the difference in opinion lies.
To see the #'s say that the 7900 has more vibes at idle doesn't tell the whole story.
i can let my 460 idle and the 7900 idle for days. The 460 will not stay in one place, the vibrations of it make it bounce around, where as the 7900 will for the most part sit in the place it was left.
The engines themselves might be where the vibes are produced, but the important # is where the vibe levels are felt at both handles.
With that being said, the 7900 has less vibes on both the front and rear handles than the 460 does. i can run my 7900 all day and not feel any strain or fatigue, yet the 460 tires my hands and arms after about 3 hours of good solid use.
manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
Freakingstang said:
Nothing wrong with rubber mounts as long as they are effective.
If it passes the vibe test and is doing better than the springs then why change it.
Freakingstang
Doctor Freakinstein
manual said:
Then why do the new stihls have the springs? (361 441).
Rubber doesn't dampen vibration feedback to the user like the springs do, but i suppose if the engine actually produces less vibes, then they would be sufficient like they have for so many years.
manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
Freakingstang said:
Well so much for all those expensive vibration meters and the engineers that run them.
All you need is a back porch and a pice of chalk. :hmm3grin2orange:
manual
Addicted to ArboristSite
Easy, two words.Freakingstang said:
#1 Maketing
#2 Mind set
Opps that is three words
Monkeyhanger
ArboristSite Guru
Hi Freakingstang,
OK it seems as if you don't quite understand what I'm trying to say but I'll try again anyway.
But first of all "I" didn't pick the Pioneer. The government decided it had just the right shade of yellow to not clash with my Army Uniform. Quite nice of them, don't you think?
Secondly, when I buy something I find out as much as I can about it first and the 7900 lost the comparison and didn't get bought. Nothing more nothing less. In fact it only lost because of the vibes, in other areas it was indeed well ahead of the 460 just as you say. I do consider vibration levels to be important, as I said my brother has white-finger and it really is "not much fun"!
Thirdly, none of the forestryworkers here use Dolmar. That also played a role in my decision against Dolmar. Considering that the Dolmars are built only a couple of hundred kilometers away from here and that nevertheless nobody actually uses them here (the Harz Mountains in Northern Germany) professionally doesn't put them in a good light.
So taking those points into consideration why should I risk spending over 1000 euros on a Dolmar?
Who said anything about running a 460 for 4 hours? Although I do, sometimes, run my 460 for up to 10 hours a day I am much, much happier when I don't have to. I much prefer carrying my 346XPG all day than the 460! In fact I'm looking for a saw with lower vibes to replace the 460 but there isn't a lot of choice if I want the same power or weight AND lower vibes.
I also said if Dolmar get the vibes down then I would certainly look at them again. But even Dolmars own figures are higher than the 460's. Does that mean they are bad mouthing themselves? Anyway as Sawtroll pointed out it may well simply be that the vibes feel different regardless of the levels involved.
I don't know why you're making such a big thing out of this just because I dared to say that the "objective" vibes of a 7900 aren't as low as your "subjective" claim. In the end the nerves in your arm don't care how the vibes "feel" but they do care a lot about the actual levels and suffer as a result.
I'm only interested in facts not "impressions","fiction","hearsay" etc. I pick the best saw available and when I bought the 460 it simply fitted the "must have" list better than the competition (not just the 7900).
I also found your "Ahh, another one that knows all because he read it somewhere on the interent." and "...you want to talk about how bad it sucks becuase you heard from your brothers' uncle's sister that it wasn't that great." comments quite arrogant and insulting. Maybe you should try keeping things a little more civilised in future and not appear to try and give the impression that you are something better. It's a forum not a boxing ring.
Just one more thing Freakingstang, don't underestimate the damage caused by vibrations. That is a genuine piece of friendly advice. Take it or leave it.
*...where did I leave my notes on de-escalation...*
Bye
OK it seems as if you don't quite understand what I'm trying to say but I'll try again anyway.
But first of all "I" didn't pick the Pioneer. The government decided it had just the right shade of yellow to not clash with my Army Uniform. Quite nice of them, don't you think?
Secondly, when I buy something I find out as much as I can about it first and the 7900 lost the comparison and didn't get bought. Nothing more nothing less. In fact it only lost because of the vibes, in other areas it was indeed well ahead of the 460 just as you say. I do consider vibration levels to be important, as I said my brother has white-finger and it really is "not much fun"!
Thirdly, none of the forestryworkers here use Dolmar. That also played a role in my decision against Dolmar. Considering that the Dolmars are built only a couple of hundred kilometers away from here and that nevertheless nobody actually uses them here (the Harz Mountains in Northern Germany) professionally doesn't put them in a good light.
So taking those points into consideration why should I risk spending over 1000 euros on a Dolmar?
Who said anything about running a 460 for 4 hours? Although I do, sometimes, run my 460 for up to 10 hours a day I am much, much happier when I don't have to. I much prefer carrying my 346XPG all day than the 460! In fact I'm looking for a saw with lower vibes to replace the 460 but there isn't a lot of choice if I want the same power or weight AND lower vibes.
I also said if Dolmar get the vibes down then I would certainly look at them again. But even Dolmars own figures are higher than the 460's. Does that mean they are bad mouthing themselves? Anyway as Sawtroll pointed out it may well simply be that the vibes feel different regardless of the levels involved.
I don't know why you're making such a big thing out of this just because I dared to say that the "objective" vibes of a 7900 aren't as low as your "subjective" claim. In the end the nerves in your arm don't care how the vibes "feel" but they do care a lot about the actual levels and suffer as a result.
I'm only interested in facts not "impressions","fiction","hearsay" etc. I pick the best saw available and when I bought the 460 it simply fitted the "must have" list better than the competition (not just the 7900).
I also found your "Ahh, another one that knows all because he read it somewhere on the interent." and "...you want to talk about how bad it sucks becuase you heard from your brothers' uncle's sister that it wasn't that great." comments quite arrogant and insulting. Maybe you should try keeping things a little more civilised in future and not appear to try and give the impression that you are something better. It's a forum not a boxing ring.
Just one more thing Freakingstang, don't underestimate the damage caused by vibrations. That is a genuine piece of friendly advice. Take it or leave it.
*...where did I leave my notes on de-escalation...*
Bye
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