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Introducing Brand New Wood Furnace to Market - The Drolet Tundra!
- Thread starter Fyrebug
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The furnace performs better with the blower and static pressure set up properly with the ductwork setup mentioned in the manual.
In case of power outage there should be enough air flow around the blower box to get some natural convection around the fire box and up the ductwork. However, there will not be enough to overcome elbows and other restrictions (horizontals) to provide meaningful heat to your house. BTW, this applies to all furnaces.
So for any lenghty power outage or if you are Amish, you want to provide as much unrestricted air flow and help out heat escape out of the unit... You could remove the top plate and ductwork but then the heat will go straight up. If you do not have a floor grating to let heat go to other part of the house you will have minimal benefits from this. The furnace job is to create heat and once that's done under power outage, it's your job to figure out a way to distribute this heat.
Remember heat rises but has a hard time to travel horizontally without help.
If you experience power outage on a regular basis in your area the best way to deal with it is to have another wood stove strategically placed somewhere else in the house for better heat distribution to help out the furnace.
The blower is strictly a convection blower not a combustion blower. It has no effect whatsoever on the flame. The blower air does not go through the heat exchanger tubes but around the combustion chamber and heat exchanger.
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UPDATE: The furnaces start shipping from our plant at the end of the month. So you should start seeing them on various web sites and stores around the first week of September.
TSC will not carry this unit.
Will let you know more shortly.
TSC will not carry this unit.
Will let you know more shortly.
Looks like it is now on Family Farm and Home's website, $1699
https://www.familyfarmandhome.com/inet/storefront/store.php?mode=showproductdetail&product=12595
https://www.familyfarmandhome.com/inet/storefront/store.php?mode=showproductdetail&product=12595
Yes, I was at FF in Grand Rapids a couple of weeks ago. They must have a promo because I thought they would retail for $1,799.
lampmfg
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
These furnaces (or any other furnaces) are not certified by the EPA. I'm sure that Fryebug is aware that they were forced to remove any reference to EPA certification from promotion or advertising since there is NO actual EPA certification for wood furnaces and the standards haven't even been finalized yet.
You can see where the advertising at Northern Tool has already been updated to reflect this.
For those of you who don't care about EPA certification then this shouldn't have any effect on your purchasing decision. As a competing manufacturer this levels out the playing field. Especially, when we have been open and honest by posting the actual Kuuma Vapor-Fire test results right on our website.
I don't know much about this furnace line but they do look nice.
I just want everyone to understand the EPA certification or lack there of. I know as a potential customer I would want this information.
You can see where the advertising at Northern Tool has already been updated to reflect this.
For those of you who don't care about EPA certification then this shouldn't have any effect on your purchasing decision. As a competing manufacturer this levels out the playing field. Especially, when we have been open and honest by posting the actual Kuuma Vapor-Fire test results right on our website.
I don't know much about this furnace line but they do look nice.
I just want everyone to understand the EPA certification or lack there of. I know as a potential customer I would want this information.These furnaces (or any other furnaces) are not certified by the EPA. I'm sure that Fryebug is aware that they were forced to remove any reference to EPA certification from promotion or advertising since there is NO actual EPA certification for wood furnaces and the standards haven't even been finalized yet.
You can see where the advertising at Northern Tool has already been updated to reflect this.
For those of you who don't care about EPA certification then this shouldn't have any effect on your purchasing decision. As a competing manufacturer this levels out the playing field. Especially, when we have been open and honest by posting the actual Kuuma Vapor-Fire test results right on our website.
I don't know much about this furnace line but they do look nice.
Not quite accurate...
1) The PSG Caddy is certified to EPA Wood stove standard ie below 6.7 gr/hr. This is listed on the EPA web site page 12. http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resources/publications/monitoring/caa/woodstoves/certifiedwood.pdf
2) Since the Tundra and Heatmax uses the same firebox we also listed and certified those under current EPA and CSA B415.1
3) The reference to EPA certification has nothing whatsoever to do whether or not the unit is furnace or not. It is an 'emission' standard that was created initially for wood stoves. Which means if you create a wood burning appliance (stove, furnace, boiler, rocket, masonry) and choose to certify to that standard that is entirely up to you. It doesn't mean your boiler is now a wood stove, it just means you can prove you burn extremely clean.
4) Your reference as to why Northern Tools had to remove the EPA logo has nothing to do whatsoever with furnaces. As of last week, EPA no longer wants MFG & retailers to use their logo. That is why if you go on our Drolet web site or any our web sites, we've created our own "This Appliance is EPA Certified" tag line. Most MFG and retailers will likely follow those rules shortly.
There's been lengthy debates about competing MFG of furnaces about the validity of EPA certification for wood furnace. What it boils down to is either their furnace does not meet EPA emission levels or they cannot afford the certification.
So if I can enlighten everyone...
1) There are currently no EPA emission certification for wood furnace. However, we chose to have our furnaces certified to the "wood stove standards" which is emissions below 7.6 gr/hr as per EPA.
2) EPA has no problem having any MFG having their furnaces certified to wood stoves emissions standards. This test is actually extremely difficult to pass. The bigger the firebox the more difficult it becomes. Therefore we are proud to advertise our furnaces even passes smaller wood stoves emissions standards. It's like saying a dump truck has the same mileage as a Jetta.
3) EPA is likely to introduce an emission standards similar to CSA B415 which will be around 4 gr/Kg wood burned. Since we already pass CSA B415 we're good to go.
4) Where else can you get a 77% efficient, smoke burning, creosote busting, EPA certified fully loaded furnace for less than $1,800? and... can get a $300 tax rebate to boot!
There is no need on this thread between MFG to debate (read pissing match) the fine points of EPA for wood furnaces. If you want I can provide the links to the previous lengthy and eye glazing debates about this.
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Family Farm is shipping it to their stores as we speak.
lampmfg
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
This sounds a little different from your explanation? I'm guessing all the retailers will follow suit but I could be wrong.
We have discussed the matter with SBI, manufacturers of Drolet Tundra Heatmax, and they have agreed to remove any claims to a furnace being EPA certified from their website and advertising/promotional materials. We also discussed the matter with Northern Tool, a distributor. They will also remove the claim from their website.
Rafael Sanchez, Ph.D.
Air Branch/Wood Heater Program Lead
Monitoring, Assistance, and Media Programs Division
Office of Compliance
U.S. EPA
3) EPA is likely to introduce an emission standards similar to CSA B415 which will be around 4 gr/Kg wood burned. Since we already pass CSA B415 we're good to go.
I'm guessing you will have to retest once the new standard is actually finalized?? I doubt the EPA doesn't want some extra cash
We have discussed the matter with SBI, manufacturers of Drolet Tundra Heatmax, and they have agreed to remove any claims to a furnace being EPA certified from their website and advertising/promotional materials. We also discussed the matter with Northern Tool, a distributor. They will also remove the claim from their website.
Rafael Sanchez, Ph.D.
Air Branch/Wood Heater Program Lead
Monitoring, Assistance, and Media Programs Division
Office of Compliance
U.S. EPA
3) EPA is likely to introduce an emission standards similar to CSA B415 which will be around 4 gr/Kg wood burned. Since we already pass CSA B415 we're good to go.
I'm guessing you will have to retest once the new standard is actually finalized?? I doubt the EPA doesn't want some extra cash
This sounds a little different from your explanation? I'm guessing all the retailers will follow suit but I could be wrong.
3) EPA is likely to introduce an emission standards similar to CSA B415 which will be around 4 gr/Kg wood burned. Since we already pass CSA B415 we're good to go.
I'm guessing you will have to retest once the new standard is actually finalized?? I doubt the EPA doesn't want some extra cash
So Garrett, tell me this... Did you get authorization to post on a very public forum what appears to be private communication between a government official and yourself?
Secondly, Did this government official provided all the details of his communication with your competitor or just enough to placate you? In other words, do you have all the details?
Please note the PSG Caddy is fully EPA certified and that will not change. There is more to this than meets the eyes.
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lampmfg
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
Was it professional to claim and market that the Drolet furnace as EPA certified when that is not the case? Apparently the EPA agrees as well.
I know being able to claim something like this without consequence would put many other furnace manufacturers at a competitive disadvantage, which I don't feel is fair. However, it's probably smart from a marketing standpoint.
lampmfg
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
I do think you designed a nice looking furnace and think it was very smart to get everyone's feedback on here to really see what the customer wanted and what they actually could get at that price point.
I just know as a consumer that I would want the facts before buying something especially when throwing the EPA's name around.
Otherwise cheers on your new furnace
I just know as a consumer that I would want the facts before buying something especially when throwing the EPA's name around.
Otherwise cheers on your new furnace
Was it professional to claim and market that the Drolet furnace as EPA certified when that is not the case? Apparently the EPA agrees as well.
I know being able to claim something like this without consequence would put many other furnace manufacturers at a competitive disadvantage, which I don't feel is fair. However, it's probably smart from a marketing standpoint.
As stated there is more to the story than meets the eyes.
It's all good...:msp_thumbup:
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Steve NW WI
Unwanted Riff Raff.
Ahhh, fall is in the air. Leaves are starting to turn, mornings are cool and crisp, and the sound of bickering stove salesmen fills the air...
Uncle Stashu
New Member
Is the first statement quoted at the crux of this issue? I.E., because the firebox came from an EPA certified furnace (Caddy) the new furnace was considered to be certified as well? I was wondering if something like this was the case even before I re-read this thread and saw the above quote. Not trying to add kindling to the fire or anything, just curious.
Read this thread and I am very interested in the Drolet, especially at that price point. Currently I am using a Woodchuck 2900 that I purchased in anticipation of switching over to anthracite coal several years ago. The switch to coal has yet to happen - I happen to enjoy running the saw and splitting the wood by hand. It's a sickness, I know. :msp_tongue: The woodchuck does coal very well (I've purchased a few bags to try it out) and it heats with wood just fine, but.....as has been discussed about older-style burners, it's not terribly efficient and I'm up on a ladder cleaning the chimney out a couple of times a season. :bang: It would be really nice to burn less wood and put away the ladder.....Oh yeah and I'd like to watch the fire through the glass door - I'd watch that for hours!!
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lampmfg
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
This actually me made lol:biggrin:
It's part of it.
Almost everyone is looking for efficiency. Kuuma's appear to be one of the most efficient however two problems for me were A. The price and B. their smaller furnace (which is all that I would need) will only take 16" wood. Having a 3 yr supply of 18" to 20" wood narrows furnace choice down. Everyone is going to plug in their criteria and look for a device that closely meets their needs. This is why "numbers" are inconsequential to the extent of finite comparisons. I burn 5 cords per year to heat my home from Oct - Apr for 1800 sq ft (not including the cellar) and this was previously done with an epa stove in the cellar. I want to burn that or less. I have a budget otherwise I'd get the largest Kuuma as I think that is one of the most efficient devices out there. Since I cannot, I want an efficient device at a price point I can afford and that seems to be the Tundra. Anything else is simply drivel to me.
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