We have oil here too, if only we were allowed to use it.......
Its Electric!
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The insane clown posse will extract the lithium using "green" tech at a cost increase of multiple factors over market.
Then manufacturers will buy lithium from China for a fraction and leave the whole endeavor a boondoggle of epic proportions.
The government will invest billions in the mining and then the mine, the assets of the mining company all will be sold to China for pennies on the dollar. The fire sale will benefit a few and we the people will be left with the tab.
And nobody will be tarred and feathered or serve prison time for it, except those who question it too loudly.
I guess I'll repeat myself...
we've been a net exporter of oil since the Obama administration
Fracking does some pretty neeto things
But also, the Oil companies are scum bags and will charge us more simply because they can.
I mean, I'm not saying your a pessimist... but...
Lightning is all electric. When the battery is dead it's dead, there's no onboard engine to recharge anything.
Yes it's a global market. We could keep enough oil on the market to keep prices low. We've done it.
I'm going to wear my "Make diesel $1.59 again" T shirt tomorrow, just for you.
Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A123_Systems
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solyndra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abound_Solar
There is a very long list of government funded failures to the tune of billions in losses.
I think it still has to be shipped to China for processing. EPA don't like lithium plants
You really gotta get out more
https://www.takomabattery.com/top-10-lithium-ion-battery-manufacturers-in-usa-in-2022/
Maybe certain models? (not working it) but my buddy has a ford, its primarily electric with gas genset, and it works rather well
and yer absolutely correct, except the GOV has nothing to do with oil prices, its the corporate scum bags that decide that, standard oil, Shell, Tesoro, Halliburton. taint a one of them controlled by anything but greed.
So rather then keep paying them, hows about we find a solution to force them to compete?
Cool, how about all the gov programs that HAVE worked and not been giant failures? Can't always be winners no matter who's responsible
I mean the gods created this world, and we still have mosquitoes.
as for they companies you linked to... for every company that applies for guv funding, and fails, 100's succeed, just cause one fails do we abandon every new idea as a failure out the gate?
Your buddy has a hybrid, not the Lightning.
Somehow we had $2 gas during orange man's presidency, and $5 gas during Obama's first, second, and now third term? Do you really think oil companies were less greedy during Mr. Spray Tan's presidency? The government was staying out of the way and letting our resources be harvested, and now it's standing in the way. That's it.
How about we not use taxpayer funds for private enterprise? Fail or succeed has nothing to do with it, that is not a legitimate function of government.
Somehow we had $2 gas during orange man's presidency, and $5 gas during Obama's first, second, and now third term? Do you really think oil companies were less greedy during Mr. Spray Tan's presidency? The government was staying out of the way and letting our resources be harvested, and now it's standing in the way. That's it.
How about we not use taxpayer funds for private enterprise? Fail or succeed has nothing to do with it, that is not a legitimate function of government.
I stand corrected... (I don't have TV so I don't see car commercialslike ever)
consider that oil co exec are all card carrying republicans that benefit with more drilling, and foreign wars everytime a GOP conman is in office? Halliburton is owned by who again? oh yeah D. Cheney, where does all the Bush families money come from? How about the Rockerfellers? they unashamedly price gouge whenever a Dem is in office, because they then get the guy that gives them all the really good dirt and leases for next to nothing.
The Function of government is the protection and prosperity of the people, full stop, if that means supporting new technology that promotes those things then you spend the money to improve protection and prosperity, otherwise the countries that DO spend money on such things will outpace us in a matter of a few years. Such gov funding is what made the USA one of if not the industrial superpower it is today.
the thing about grants and gov loans, is...
We all benefit from it, maybe/probably not directly, but every new company creates jobs, creates income, that income creates more tax revenue, often times much much more then the gov invested. Every job added means one more person not on food stamps or section 8 housing, in the long run investing in small businesses or cutting edge technology reduces poverty, and reduces dependency on gov handouts, and it is an investment, while "free money" is out there you have to actually do the work to get it, and most of the money for these types of programs are in the form of loans that have to be paid back WITH interest.
edit:
I mean, we can all keep whining about wellfare queens, and lazy no good xxxx folks and how they are a drain on society, or... we can spend the money that creates jobs and helps build people up rather then continue to talk down to them and keep them "othered" so that those with jobs can have someone to feel superior too. Which route do you suppose is more cost effective?
We all benefit from it, maybe/probably not directly, but every new company creates jobs, creates income, that income creates more tax revenue, often times much much more then the gov invested. Every job added means one more person not on food stamps or section 8 housing, in the long run investing in small businesses or cutting edge technology reduces poverty, and reduces dependency on gov handouts, and it is an investment, while "free money" is out there you have to actually do the work to get it, and most of the money for these types of programs are in the form of loans that have to be paid back WITH interest.
edit:
I mean, we can all keep whining about wellfare queens, and lazy no good xxxx folks and how they are a drain on society, or... we can spend the money that creates jobs and helps build people up rather then continue to talk down to them and keep them "othered" so that those with jobs can have someone to feel superior too. Which route do you suppose is more cost effective?
I am trying not to get into the weeds too far here, I do not want to be the reason the thread gets moved.
There are a lot of failures in this particular segment of the economy, a whole lot of them.
Back the truck up! Sacred grounds, do not pass Go, do not collect $200.
(Notice the date of article, about as recent as it gets)
https://meaww.com/the-mc-dermitt-ca...lithium-reservoir-lies-in-nevada-supervolcano
I don't see how this link is a counter argument to refining lithium ore which it was in response to. I read a few minutes and never saw the word cell only battery.
From the one post/link above "According to the outlet, the average battery-grade lithium carbonate price was $37,000 per metric ton as of 2022"
I don't study the process of getting the pre cursors to the cylindrical or pouch cells, I do think the China monopoly is likely overstated by some if not many.
welllll
If you read the article I already posted, it mentions the tribes and other groups sued, and LOST already so?
Besides that area has been mined for over 100 years, for all sorts of fun stuff like Uranium and only now someone says its "sacred" yeah ok
Don't get me wrong we shouldn't be tearing up actual sacred sites, but sounds like someone heard 11.4 Trillion dollars and thought, sheeeeeite I could get me some of that.
I mean, if you throw a rock anywhere in this country you could feasibly argue that it has some "cultural significance" to some tribe somewhere, or some previously unknown flora/fauna and it absolutely needs to be protected because?
But also, its almost like folks just don't want to escape oil dependency... or maybe, the big lawyers the "tribes" are "hiring" are being paid by a third party...
Hard to say how it will pan out. My article is more current than yours, could be they just didn't have current info, but alegedly there are existing lawsuits against BLM for allowing the permitting.
I have heard of that area mentioned for over a decade now so it is nothing new. I found it interesting that actual geologists are calling the estimation "paper napkin estimates."
If they treat this type of mining like any others they'll drive the price of Lithium up and subsequently vehicle prices. That area hasn't been pursued more heavily for a reason, its expensive to do business here compared to South America and China.
yeah, I do agree with most of that
Seems the latest suit is very current, and I think based in NV where as most of the prior mining took place on the OR side. So, its anyones guess.
Think they discovered lithium in 2017? there, the news of it is being the largest known deposit.
Though there are active lithium mines in Canaddada, and Montucky?
There is significant desire to have domestic lithium production here in the US, if only for military reasons, There is skookum about the army wanting Electric or even hybrid electric tanks sooner then later. Which would make domestic production a necessity if only for ITAR reasons
Note: ITAR is one of the many reasons I got out of machining, seems everyone wants to make bombs around here, and I'd rather not see my work dropped on some illiterate goon simply for the bomb companies to turn a profit... General Dynamics, Rocketdyne, Boeing, few others I can't remember are all a big deal around here... I was much happier making medical lasers and parts for weirdo's with crazy ideas about coffee. Not to mention that the tolerances for the bomb people were simply stupid, mirror finishes on bolts, and minor parts, things that will never be seen by another living being, simply to drive up the cost, the greed alone turned my stomach. MIL-SPEC is all fine and good, and most things are made with those tolerances in mind (really MIl-SPEC is pretty forgiving) so when the tolerances on a given part are tighter then that, it makes you question why, when you know it could be way sloppier and still form fit and function, but be 300% cheaper to produce...
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