Looking For 16" Welded-Laminated Guide Bars

[SteveSr]

Hello,

I am trying to avoid any glued-laminated bars which I think are all Oregon makes these days.

I like Tsumura but these lower end bars seem to be even harder to find with the pandemic. Does anyone know who the importer for the U.S. is? I have also seen folks on Ebay advertising Total as being made by Tsumura. Is there any truth to that?

Current Needs:

Husqvarna 345 - .050" .325" 66DL => Tsumura 388UC2 - Google search for this part number turns up empty.

Stihl MS250 - .063" .325" 62DL => It doesn't appear that Tsumura makes .325/.063 in the Stihl 3005 bar mount.

Any other suggestions?

 

[SimonHS]

Sugihara Pro Lam (Super Light)?

BC2M-0H40P-A for the 345 and SL2M-3J40-A for the MS250.

 

[SteveSr]

Sugihara Pro Lam (Super Light)?

BC2M-0H40P-A for the 345 and SL2M-3J40-A for the MS250.

Thanks, but these appear to be EU/UK stock only. I need to find something that is available in the U.S.

 

[SteveSr]

@Philbert ... Any suggestions? This is for a volunteer trail crew which is why I'm cost sensitive and wish to avoid the glued bars that can come unglued if overheated i.e. cut with a dull chain.

 

[Philbert]

I don’t have any special insights on availability for any products or models under current conditions.

Solid, milled bars are heavier, more durable, and more expensive. The replaceable sprocket nose (‘RSN’) models are a good investment for longevity, provided that the equipment is well maintained. Oregon, STIHL, and Husqvarna all make these.

Most laminated bars are spot welded, and better ones will hold up with reasonable care. They are less expensive to make and to buy, and a reasonable choice for anyone on a budget. The 3 companies above also make these.

The only glued, laminated bars I know of are lightweight models, with a different core material than the outsides. The adhesive makes the bar stiffer then a spot welded bar, which is noticeable on narrow kerf models. I don’t know of problems with delamination, and if so, they are likely covered by warranty.

For trail use by volunteers, I would probably choose a standard, spot welded, laminated bar, if I was on a budget. These can be hard use conditions, and I would have replacement costs in mind as well. Especially, if they are run with dull, poorly tensioned, or poorly lubricated chains, which can cause other, excessive bar wear.

Sticking with one of those 3 brands should get you a quality product. Total has been out of business for many years, but some products may still be floating around. Their products were contracted out to other manufacturers.

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

ArcherPlus is a a US distributor of TsuMura guide bars, via their website or their eBay store. Pretty good guys to deal with. Founded by a guy who worked for the parent company that sold the Total brand saw products.

Philbert

 

[SteveSr]

ArcherPlus is a a US distributor of TsuMura guide bars, via their website or their eBay store. Pretty good guys to deal with. Founded by a guy who worked for the parent company that sold the Total brand saw products.

Philbert

I think that Total was a house brand for Tilton, a big distributor. I could be wrong but I don't think they are still around.

 

[SteveSr]

I don’t have any special insights on availability for any products or models under current conditions.

Solid, milled bars are heavier, more durable, and more expensive. The replaceable sprocket nose (‘RSN’) models are a good investment for longevity, provided that the equipment is well maintained. Oregon, STIHL, and Husqvarna all make these.

Most laminated bars are spot welded, and better ones will hold up with reasonable care. They are less expensive to make and to buy, and a reasonable choice for anyone on a budget. The 3 companies above also make these.

The only glued, laminated bars I know of are lightweight models, with a different core material than the outsides. The adhesive makes the bar stiffer then a spot welded bar, which is noticeable on narrow kerf models. I don’t know of problems with delamination, and if so, they are likely covered by warranty.

For trail use by volunteers, I would probably choose a standard, spot welded, laminated bar, if I was on a budget. These can be hard use conditions, and I would have replacement costs in mind as well. Especially, if they are run with dull, poorly tensioned, or poorly lubricated chains, which can cause other, excessive bar wear.

Sticking with one of those 3 brands should get you a quality product. Total has been out of business for many years, but some products may still be floating around. Their products were contracted out to other manufacturers.

Philbert

Did I say how much I HATE marketing speak! Oregon's 2019 catalog is a 240Mb PDF file chock full of it.

After spending FAR too long in this catalog I came up with the following part numbers:

Husky 345 - 160VXLGK095 - Versa Cut (Advance Cut discontinued)

Stihl MS250 -

163PXLBA074 - Control Cut
163PXBA074 - Advance Cut

My challenge to any of you is to tell which of these is laminated/welded OR laminated/glued?

 

[Philbert]

My challenge to any of you is to tell which of these is laminated/welded OR laminated/glued?

Contact Oregon Customer Service:

Forestry: 1-800-223-5168
[email protected]

The company was sold a few years back, and your friends in marketing changed / ‘reorganized’ all the familiar names into ‘product families’ a few years before that. Their website used to contain a lot more useful, technical information.

Any bar with an aluminum core is likely to be bonded rather than spot welded.

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

I think that Total was a house brand for Tilton, a big distributor. I could be wrong but I don't think they are still around.

Right.

But a key employee maintained connections with TsuMura, Tecomec, and other Tilton related brands, and distributes these through ArcherPlus.

Some Total branded TsuMura bars May still be floating around as ‘NOS’ (new, old stock) on warehouse shelves somewhere. But your best option is to contact him to check on new bars, if that those are what you are interested in.

Philbert

 

[Franny K]

Did I say how much I HATE marketing speak! Oregon's 2019 catalog is a 240Mb PDF file chock full of it.

After spending FAR too long in this catalog I came up with the following part numbers:

Husky 345 - 160VXLGK095 - Versa Cut (Advance Cut discontinued)

Stihl MS250 -

163PXLBA074 - Control Cut
163PXBA074 - Advance Cut

My challenge to any of you is to tell which of these is laminated/welded OR laminated/glued?

The versacut, control cut and speedcut Are the aluminum core.

https://www.oregonproducts.com/medi...lNzFkZGRkYzJjOGE0NTg0OWJiZjJiNDRlNzU2NzNlZjAw
I believe the advance cut is the renamed double guard which was renamed pro am and now is advance cut. How much is a 62 (edited) drive link (16 called inches in 3005) Stihl bar?

Here is a listing on ebay for an advance cut that is obviously spot welded. All the ones for your exact code use stock photos.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/175317866884?hash=item28d1c25984:g:SGUAAOSw6iBip9Ie

 

[SteveSr]

The company was sold a few years back, and your friends in marketing changed / ‘reorganized’ all the familiar names into ‘product families’ a few years before that. Their website used to contain a lot more useful, technical information.

It looks like they were sold / re-orged once again in 2021. They are now called Oregon Tool.

Any bar with an aluminum core is likely to be bonded rather than spot welded.

Agreed.

 

[SteveSr]

The versacut, control cut and speedcut Are the aluminum core.

Agreed.

I also de-ciphered that "Speedcut" is their marketing speak for Narrow Kerf.

I believe the advance cut is the renamed double guard which was renamed pro am and now is advance cut. How much is a 55 drive link (16 called inches in 3005) Stihl bar?

Stihl is exorbitantly expensive in our mid-atlantic region as Husqvarna has gone extinct. This is why I am looking at AM bars.

Here is a listing on ebay for an advance cut that is obviously spot welded. All the ones for your exact code use stock photos.

I don't see any listing...

AdvanceCut is the only on that I can't find any construction specifics on.

 

[Franny K]

I omitted the link yesterday.

Here is a house brand one from Baileys. https://www.baileysonline.com/woodlandpro-timbermax-lite-325-pitch-chainsaw-bars-wptl.html

Here is the Genuine Stihl one at Baileys which can be quite a mark up from a Stihl shop. https://www.baileysonline.com/stihl-rollomatic-e-325-pitch-chainsaw-guide-bars-qs-rme.html

3005 000 4713 is the part number that brings up some choices at ebay and likely on the internet in general.

If you don't have an inventory of chain for the Stihl one going .325NK or 3/8 lo pro could also be possible. A universal mount Nk bar would likely make the chains compatible with that Husqvarna 345. I run a Baileys universal mount house brand 72 drive link 18" called length on my ms251. That would be 66 drive links for the 16". https://www.baileysonline.com/woodl...f-chainsaw-bar-chain-combinations-wpc-nk.html

Last time or 2 I reached out to Oregon via email the result was rather poor.
Exactly what the groove width is can be a bit of a gamble with those glued together, perhaps new ones are better now.

​

 

[SteveSr]

I omitted the link yesterday.

Here is a house brand one from Baileys. https://www.baileysonline.com/woodlandpro-timbermax-lite-325-pitch-chainsaw-bars-wptl.html

Here is the Genuine Stihl one at Baileys which can be quite a mark up from a Stihl shop. https://www.baileysonline.com/stihl-rollomatic-e-325-pitch-chainsaw-guide-bars-qs-rme.html

3005 000 4713 is the part number that brings up some choices at ebay and likely on the internet in general.

If you don't have an inventory of chain for the Stihl one going .325NK or 3/8 lo pro could also be possible. A universal mount Nk bar would likely make the chains compatible with that Husqvarna 345. I run a Baileys universal mount house brand 72 drive link 18" called length on my ms251. That would be 66 drive links for the 16". https://www.baileysonline.com/woodl...f-chainsaw-bar-chain-combinations-wpc-nk.html

I am on the opposite coast from Bailey's so seldom do business with them due to higher prices on top of higher shipping costs. Again, with Bailey's house brand it is hard to know exactly what you are getting. I have some Woodland Pro chains for another saw that say Carlton on the tie straps

Last time or 2 I reached out to Oregon via email the result was rather poor.
Exactly what the groove width is can be a bit of a gamble with those glued together, perhaps new ones are better now.

It sounds like you had a past bad experience with glued bars. This is what I am trying to avoid with our volunteers. They also tend to do a lot of bore cutting which may be harder on the bar.

 

[SteveSr]

Well, I finally got a hold of someone at Oregon Tool. The rep confirmed that the AdvanceCut was the only laminated/welded bar in their lineup. All other laminated bars are glued.

He also looked up the part numbers for my application as:

160PXBK095 - 16" .325 .050" - Husky
163PXBA074 - 16" .325 .063" - Stihl

He also said that the Husky part number wasn't listed in the 2022 catalog but was still available. It looks like the best way to check availability is to put a correct part number together and throw it into Google and see what comes up.

Oregon sure makes it hard to work with!

 

[Franny K]

There is no longer a higher grade laminated (spot welded) bar like the pro 91 or pro lite. Echo does market the Cs361p which does come with essentially a pro 91 spot welded laminated bar so what they offer retail is likely different than what OEM can order.

 

[Czed]

Hello,

I am trying to avoid any glued-laminated bars which I think are all Oregon makes these days.

I like Tsumura but these lower end bars seem to be even harder to find with the pandemic. Does anyone know who the importer for the U.S. is? I have also seen folks on Ebay advertising Total as being made by Tsumura. Is there any truth to that?

Current Needs:

Husqvarna 345 - .050" .325" 66DL => Tsumura 388UC2 - Google search for this part number turns up empty.

Stihl MS250 - .063" .325" 62DL => It doesn't appear that Tsumura makes .325/.063 in the Stihl 3005 bar mount.

Any other suggestions?

This?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3831495098...pYG1_FAe1UC7OpAttrHbrd5sskXUzSlgaAniuEALw_wcB
I have over 30 tsumura many since the 80s excellent bar's

 

[SteveSr]

This?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3831495098...pYG1_FAe1UC7OpAttrHbrd5sskXUzSlgaAniuEALw_wcB
I have over 30 tsumura many since the 80s excellent bar's

No, that is a replaceable tip solid bar. I am looking for the half the cost laminated welded version.

 

[cookies]

Walk into a tractor supply or home depot and grab a trail link bar/chain, they are not bad and you can stop looking for stuff thats nla or go for the stihl/husky laminate bars as they are not glued. Solid one piece bars with replaceable tips are expensive, the newer tsumuras have only 4 rivets in the roller tip and 3 holding the tip to the bar so not what I would bore cut with all day but I sill love them. Oregon will be 80% of the cost of oem but their rails are soft and their crap is confusing with having so many models and changes/renames. Sugi is a good choice, very high quality and simple to figure out. But being trail and on a budget I'd get the cheap laminates with welded rails from tail link and simply toss them as necessary. There is someone selling off a large inventory of total super bars on ebay currently, old sabre bars would be another good choice if they pop up.