Lots of questions about footlocking

[basnighttrees]

Thanks in advance for all your advice. I am learning to FL for pruning. I learned to climb with spikes so I normally would just walk up the lead or limb. I set a line in a fiction saver, use a double asender instead of a prusik, then climb with "the knot". I have read some other treads and my options for moving back up once I come down some are to FL the tail or air hump.
Question 1, is that the prefered way or most efficient?
Question 2, Once I am up in the tree how do I move around to work? I mean from limb to limb, up a lead, etc?
I was in a huge pin oak and when I needed to go back up I could not FL the tail because it would have swung me away from the limb I wanted to get to.
Question 3, Should I choose a tie in point close to the truck or away from it?
Question 4, For those of you that FL and use spikes, once you are good at climbing w/out spikes is it faster to work in the tree for both pruning and take downs.
Question 5, Is FL better on your body over the years than spikes? I would think that spike may take a toll on your knees, Is FL healthier? Thanks again for your help.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Footlock?

 

[basnighttrees]

Hey MB I read before where you have never FL before. Have you started using FL more? You have been climbing for some time. Have you notice any problems with your knees?

 

[Stumper]

I don't footlock. I certainly don't prune on gaffs. I do use a Pantin(but not often) . I do body thrust. I'm a slow climber and hardly the authority on efficient work aloft but while gaffs have helped my removal work I can't imagine pruning with them-partly because it is WRONG but also because they are in the way when swinging and limbwalking. One thing I do when moving around in a tree is use my lanyard a lot-Swing the end around that other lead and pull myself over with the lanyard, throw an end through that crotch above me and pull myself up to where I can find a foothold to move on up a lead etc.

 

[jkrueger]

_Never use spikes except for take downs._

I've found that FL even when close to the trunck is a lot less work than body thrusting. Since I've FL I do no other. Your other questions are not clear to me.

Hope this helps,
Jack

 

[MasterBlaster]

Hey MB I read before where you have never FL before. Have you started using FL more? You have been climbing for some time. Have you notice any problems with your knees?

Never foot-locked, no knee problems, the shoulders sometimes hurt.

 

[clearance]

Spurless climbing is heavily mocked by us utility guys but good for you trying something different. Don't get crazy and start doing removals without spikes though.

 

[Lumberjack]

I do 90% of my removals spikeless.

I use the pantin.

I beat the local "fastest, best climber" of the big orange side by side.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I do 90% of my removals spikeless.

I use the pantin.

I beat the local "fastest, best climber" of the big orange side by side.

Yah right, bring it on down to the bayou, we'll have a 'lil race!

 

[Lumberjack]

How about I hire you and we call it even?

 

[RedlineIt]

I've never been able to footlock to save my life. Three or four locks and I'd get muscle cramps in my glutes. I tried FLing this way, that way, I just couldn't "get it".

Air humping is so tediously slow. I used to go to great lengths to get my throw line on the climbable side of the trunk, I can bodythrust like my ropes on fire, but tossing my throw-line back over twice to get a good alley for bodythrusting was wasting time.

I even got to know which trunks and types of bark I could just shinny up, sometimes with a lanyard, sometimes just with grippy gloves. I still do that sometimes, it's like spurring without spurs, you just never extend your knees past the point of being able to hold onto your purchase.

Then I was shown the pantin. Omigawd, a whole new world!

Now I don't care if my line is away from the trunk. Hell, if its a great TIP, the further the better! I can ascend with the pantin just as if I had exceptional footlocking skills, only easier.

The pantin rocks.

In question 2, it sounds like you may have used a redirect that sewered yourself, but your description is unclear.

How did you eventually get to that branch? Did the eventual solution tell you anything about your TIP or where you should have gone first?

Sometimes going up and down, up and down and choosing your new TIP is the only way. With time you will learn to make the most of each TIP.

 

[basnighttrees]

Is it better to be close to the trunk or away from it when choosing a TIP? I know this is a open ended question that is different from tree to tree. If one has to move all over a huge canapy to prune dead wood is it better to choose one TIP in the top center or choose TIP in different sections of a tree.

On the tree I was in the TIP was about 8 feet from the trunk in the top center between the two areas I had to work. I went up to were I thought was a good spot to start and lateral to the place were needed to start rigging and cutting. For me to move around in the tree I had to free climb, meaning my weight was not in my climbing line. I used my landyard to secure myself before making a cut. It just felt uncomfortable not leaning into my climbing line.

The work area was on both side of the tree so I chose a TIP in the middle of both areas. From what RedLineIt said maybe I should have chose two different TIP.

 

[clearance]

Somebody anwer question #4. Lumberjack, when you beat the guy from the big orange machine, could you explain the circumstance, like you were both climbing the same sized trees to remove them, him with spikes, you without or what? You guys know I'm a utility hack and I climb with spurs always so don't hack on me, I do what I feel safe with.

 

[CODIT]

Use a redirect or double crotch your climbing line to get two points of connection. You are right when you say every tree is different so you have to make a plan and work the plan out. If you dont have a copy of The Tree Climbers Companion you need to purchase one and it will help greatly in devloping your climbing skills. Placing your first connection in the tree is important to the whole job according to what you plan to do in the tree. So place your line according to "Your Plan" or as close as possible and redirect or double crotch as you "Work Out The Plan". Also a 2 in one Lanyard is great to help getting from one place to another.

 

[Jim1NZ]

1. Footlocking is the most ergonomic and efficient way to ascend a tree with out spikes.
That is if you know how to do it correctly.
No fancy ascenders required.
2. Once at the top of the tree, lanyard in, set up you friction device, and rope in. You may have to climb a little higher than you could throw ball to get the best place to tie in.
3. Its way easier to footlock out from the trunk, but its possible to do it next to the trunk but dont try it unless your good at the ftk.
4. Its faster to do every thing in the tree with out spikes, except of cource on take downs.
5. With properly set up spikes and the correct use of them, you will be able to climb in spikes all your life. But with out them you dont have any chance of spiking yourself!

Bs - you never have to free climb bro.
Best option would be to set up a retrievable redirect like CODIT said.

 

[basnighttrees]

I will go back and look at the tree climber companion. I picked up 2 copies yesterday. Between that book, sherrill cat., arbor master training, and time I have learned alot. I am new to this site and I am learning well here also. Thanks for everyones imput. I will get some loop runners and biners for redirect.

 

[Lumberjack]

Somebody anwer question #4. Lumberjack, when you beat the guy from the big orange machine, could you explain the circumstance, like you were both climbing the same sized trees to remove them, him with spikes, you without or what? You guys know I'm a utility hack and I climb with spurs always so don't hack on me, I do what I feel safe with.

Yes, same size trees, side by side, with a similar DZ.

It wasnt an official race, like we started with a gun or anything like that. We both started at the same time and I was on the ground first. Someone else who works for the orange said I was faster.

I am sure that under different circumstances it woulda been different. Spikeless is doable is my main point.

 

[basnighttrees]

I do 90% of my removals spikeless.

I use the pantin.

I am starting to use my imagination on how a removal can be done without spikes. What are the 10% of removal situations when you use spikes.

 

[Tree Machine]

The 10% is when you have long leads that have no limbs, and you have to climb above your tie-in point. It's possible to shinny up the limbless lead, but say you got up there, took the top out and you're cutting firewood chunks off on the way back down, there's just no real practical, efficient way to keep yourself from slipping down while maneuvering your chainsaw. When chunking down a limbless lead, you should be tied in twice (climbing rope and flipline), but your climbing line will not be above you supporting your weight. This is where spikes are a natural choice.

 

[Tree Machine]

I'm with lumberjack. My spikes are critical and essential, but they don't get a whole lot of use.

I find that when I have spikes on for a takedown, I tend to climb as if I don't have them on, except for situations like the long, limbless spar, and of course the final trunk chunk-down.