My Stihl Dealer is Absolutely Horrible. I'm Done.

[struggle]

Off topic sort of but not. I bought a commercial Toro (walk behind)15 years ago or so. Man I am getting old.

Anyways it was the model where they just started putting the safety crap on the commercial models and I removed the flywheel clutch brake and kill switch on it. Then something broke on it shortly after (don't recall what it was, I have slept since then). Unrelated to what I had done. So I took it in under warrnaty.

Owner came out and sternly said never ever bring it back in for repair as long as the safety stuff was by passed. Keep in mind I had bought several thousands dollars of equipment from them over a ten year period in the commercial mowing business which meant nothing compared to the risk of being sued for allowing something federally mandated to go out of his shop after they touched it. Just not worth the risk to them.

 

[stihl.logger]

my closest Stihl dealer is 600' across the road from me in a JD shop, i don't bother with them either. i have a buddy named john that runs a family owned Stihl dealership, Cass Outdoor Power, in the next town over and goes over the top when it comes to modded saws. i know you prob wouldnt want to drive clear to Cassopolis, Mi. but i could give you his number, he would talk shop with you till your ear fell off....

 

[spacemule]

Spacemule - Allow me to start by using your own advice. In learning what to do before starting school, I'm sure you were taught that if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. All other responses to this thread thus far have been completely useful, aside from this one. I'll follow that in saying that my intent in this reply is not to start trouble with you. However, you CAN stow the attitude while still getting your message across.

In response to the message itself, perhaps it's you who needs to re-evaluate how you read people. If you had understood the writing correctly, you'd have gathered that the question I pose to a front desk guy is, itself, consisting of basic mechanics. Until I can make a judgment on the level of expertise of my audience, I need to keep the questions simple and concise.

Now I may come off as defensive here, but I can't help but be a little taken back by your response. It's not your place to make a judgment call about me.....on something you don't know. I've had 6 years worth of electrical engineering in schooling and another 10 years of mechanical engineering for the military. Take MacLaren's advice and don't judge a book by its cover.

We're all here to learn something and to teach something else. I may only be a few years into AS, and this is my first FULL build of a saw. But you can bet your a$$ I'll pick it up quick and there's gonna be some pretty informative posts from me on this build.

I don't care what experience you have. Admitting you throw a tantrum because a parts dealer didn't stroke your ego is not the mark of a repsonsible nor reasonable nor competent individual. First, you said you could hardly contain yourself from driving in a reckless manner while leaving the shop. Then, you feel sorry for the next clerk because you were in a piss poor mood because you didn't get your way. Finally, you came home to your wife with a ####ty attitude. Why? Because a parts clerk said something you didn't like and acted like he didn't think you knew what you were doing. That's all I need to know that you are a twit who throws tantrums and needs his ego stroked--that is, unless you're just making this all up. Somehow, I doubt that.

 

[z71mike]

bottom line your stock carb with stock needles should work fine. all the 046/460 gtg builds afaik are using what came with the saw. the 460 carb should be plenty.

Thanks. That's what I'll wind up running. I was just thinking back to the days of my Honda 250R with a Duncan Racing carb and full range kit of jets that came with it. 2 pilot jets, 2 needles, and 4 main jets.

Guess I got ahead of myself. I'll start normal and maybe work from there and see what happens.

 

[mikefunaro]

I understand your frustration and where you're at, but it's not that hard to understand the dealer either.

First off, the majority of saw users are perfectly content running non-modded saws. The dealer, assuming that he runs a saw, is included in this evidently.

I'm sure you've realized this, but there's lots of guess work in modding saws. Just look at the threads in here. "does this work"? "can I go wider?" what do you think about this? The guy doesn't know anything about changing needles. He's not trained in it. Even if he did it himself, he's not going to endorse what stihl doesn't recommend. and of course stihl cant recommend doing something like that. The last thing this guy wants is you calling stihl telling them some hack job told you to put x y and z in your saw, and you did that, and it blew up.

Things come the way they do for a reason. Some of it is meeting EPA, but some of it is because that's what works, what works safely, what works reliably, etc.

If you want a dealer to be supportive of you, you have to find someone who likes modding saws.

But I totally undersatnd where the dealer is at here.

 

[struggle]

Thanks. That's what I'll wind up running. I was just thinking back to the days of my Honda 250R with a Duncan Racing carb and full range kit of jets that came with it. 2 pilot jets, 2 needles, and 4 main jets.

Guess I got ahead of myself. I'll start normal and maybe work from there and see what happens.

Or like jetting a Yamaha V-Max 700 snowmobile. Main jet, mid jets or what ever they are called and then the needle settings with the shims and then primary and secondary clutch settign to coperate with new jetting etc:msp_scared:

Kind of makes saw settings seem well not so baduttahere2:

 

[audible fart]

It seems the general feeling is that dealers can't and won't talk anything other than stock for more reasons than just lack of knowledge base. I believe all of you are right. I guess I just had these false hopes that something would come of it. I do plan on checking out the Stihl-shack though. I'll probably get alot more BS'ing time with that guy, on top of the fact that I'll be spending money to help out the little guy, where the JD dealer has multi-thousand dollar machines going in and out on a daily basis and doesn't care if he misses my few hundred bucks a year.

Thanks guys.
MIKE

There is a huge difference between some of the stihl dealers around here. It's like they have no standards about what the minimum they can stock is. In fact, before i found this website, i walked into my local stihl dealer with every intention of buying the biggest saw they had. And i did. That saw was an MS390. If they would have had a 460 or 660 so i'd have known either of those saws actually existed, i would own one of them now instead of the MS390. It's been a good saw that does what i need it to do though. Not stocking stihl ultra on purpose is pathetic though. I think the guy doesn't stock it on purpose because of the extended warranty you get if you buy it when you buy a new product. It is sad that you can't even talk to a mechanic about modifications without them being fearful of lawsuits. It's actually pathetic. Especially if you begin the conversation with the statement that you have full knowledge of possible reliability issues that could happen when you do modifications. But this is 2011. We've got a president that bows to grown men and a chief of homeland security that comes across like a dike at the bowling alley. Things ain't what they used to be. I mean, talking to a mechanic about working on a saw? What are you nuts?

 

[z71mike]

I don't care what experience you have. Admitting you throw a tantrum because a parts dealer didn't stroke your ego is not the mark of a repsonsible nor reasonable nor competent individual. First, you said you could hardly contain yourself from driving in a reckless manner while leaving the shop. Then, you feel sorry for the next clerk because you were in a piss poor mood because you didn't get your way. Finally, you came home to your wife with a ####ty attitude. Why? Because a parts clerk said something you didn't like and acted like he didn't think you knew what you were doing. That's all I need to know that you are a twit who throws tantrums and needs his ego stroked--that is, unless you're just making this all up. Somehow, I doubt that.

I do realize after the fact that I over reacted, as most of us do from time to time. It happens.

The issue isn't about a stroked ego. It's about respect, or lack thereof. After a short answer from the counter guy and basically a grab for my money, I was quickly dismissed. That there is a lack of respect. I was taught to respect people, as I have taught my kids as well. Respect goes a long way in life.

Just relax, man. We don't need to get all bent out of shape here. I just wanted to blow off some steam and share a story.

Truce?

 

[z71mike]

We've got a president that bows to grown men and a chief of homeland security that comes across like a dike at the bowling alley. Things ain't what they used to be. I mean, talking to a mechanic about working on a saw? What are you nuts?

HAHAHAHAA couldn't have said it better myself

 

[z71mike]

Or like jetting a Yamaha V-Max 700 snowmobile. Main jet, mid jets or what ever they are called and then the needle settings with the shims and then primary and secondary clutch settign to coperate with new jetting etc:msp_scared:

Kind of makes saw settings seem well not so baduttahere2:

I think you're right, man. Can't be as hard as it used to be on the other stuff. Though I never had to deal with those clutch settings on the R........... :msp_smile:

 

[sirstanesq]

hate my dealer too

I also won't shop at my local stihl dealer. I would go in with a part number and they wouldn't even look it up, just give me a "ball park" estimate and ask if I wanted to order it. I also don't mind markup and understand that is how every retail business functions, what I do get upset about is more than double the price at another stihl dealer. Example, ignition module for an ms 361, Part number 1135-400-1300 Should be around 55 to 65 bucks new from stihl. Dealer quotes me a price of "Oh i dunno, something like $100 to $120, you want me to order it?" Besides that, they don't stock ANYTHING! They had to order a 325, .061 18 inch chain for crying out loud. He wouldn't even consider taking one off the showroom saws to help me out. But I was stuck with him or trying to find parts online.

The last time I went in, he wouldn't order any parts, because the Forest Service had just placed "a huge order" and I would put him over the limit.....What my money isn't as good as the Forest Service's? Well it may not be thousands and thousands, but tell you what, I pay cash in advance. This was the last straw. I have since found another sthil dealer 6 hours away, have a great relationship with the parts guy there and don't mind paying the extra few dollars for shipping; and what do you know, his prices are reasonable! I will probably buy my next saw from them.

Its too bad about stihl's dealer policy. I can understand that it may look good on paper and if your lucky enough to have a local dealer (or event two or three to choose from) that are good, its really a non issue (less cost for parts, but that's another thread). But its when your suck with one crappy dealer, that it all falls apart (and makes me want to buy a Husky, just kidding!)

 

[z71mike]

my closest Stihl dealer is 600' across the road from me in a JD shop, i don't bother with them either. i have a buddy named john that runs a family owned Stihl dealership, Cass Outdoor Power, in the next town over and goes over the top when it comes to modded saws. i know you prob wouldnt want to drive clear to Cassopolis, Mi. but i could give you his number, he would talk shop with you till your ear fell off....

Man, I'm jealous. If I find myself having to do any travel leave to Detroit Arsenal, I may have to swing over to that shop to shoot the breeze. Thanks for the heads up. I haven't been out that way in a few years, but ya never know what comes up nowadays.

 

[STIHLTHEDEERE]

I need to get some stuff off my chest.

I have completely HAD it with my local Stihl dealer. They're a John Deere dealership that also sells Stihl. On the Stihl website, they are listed as the premier dealer in the area. I've never bought much chainsaw stuff from them outside of lubricants and odds&ends like flippy caps, trimmer line, etc. Though I've spent thousands in JD stuff, which they knew right off the bat when I supplied my customer info as I walked in.

Well, in the past few months, I've been scouring eBay and CL for parts for my 046 build. I figured I might as well stop into the dealer and start up some conversations to maybe build the beginnings of a relationship with the saw techs. As I know I'll need them for the minor parts like nuts and bolts and anything else under 20 bucks. I'm really only buying the big expensive stuff online when I find a deal.

I had to get some mower parts anyway, so I was making the trip already. After the guy at the counter got my JD parts, he asked if I needed anything else. I said "yeah, I need to bounce some ideas off one of your saw guys. I got some pretty specific carburetor questions."

He nods and says, "Well, whatta ya got?"

"See, I'm doing a full ground-up build on an 046, ported out and everything. Going with a big performance build. And I wanted to get some ideas for which carb I should go with, what size needles, and some general ideas on increasing my air/fuel delivery to a heavily ported engine."

He replies, "All I can tell ya is that we always use whatever is stock and I can just point you to the factory parts."

Already pissed of at his response, I say, "Ahh, but you can supply me different needles for the carb!!!" .....thinking I had undermined his shrug-off by finding a loop hole.

He goes, "Well, I don't recommend anything other than stock or you're gonna be putting yourself at a risk..."

By this time, he saw the look on my face. I had completely shut down and had this look like WHAT ARE YOU FKN KIDDING ME GUY?!?!?! As he finished his sentence, I stood there fuming mad, in dead silence, in utter disbelief that I was getting dismissed like this. Is he kidding me? A risk? I'm building my own saw, porting it out, and obviously building a very custom piece.....blatently obvious that I know what I'm doing.

After about 5 seconds of dead air, (which is a long time in conversation - think about it) he puts the JD parts on the counter and says, "Will that be all? You're total comes to" blah blah blah....

I squared up with him, and walked out without wasting another breath. I then had to hold myself back from laying my 35" BFG AT's all over his parking lot as I rattled his windows with dual Flowmasters and rather politely tore out of the place.

I was completely furious that I just finally decided to give these idiots the benefit of the doubt, only to get slapped back down by outright lunacy. It honestly took me about an hour to calm down. I feel bad for the poor Hindu at the ShopRight register that checked me out on my way home, buying some groceries for dinner. I gave her the $hittiest attitude...

Anyway....I had to vent this to someone who might give a d^mn, as my wife didn't really care much for the story and just wanted my attitude gone when I walked into the house. Needless to say, I'll be trying the shack up the road from the Arsenal next time with the Stihl sign hanging by a thread on the outside of his little ice-fishing-shack-lookin-atrocity. Honestly, I've been a little intimidated to walk into this tiny place b/c it looks like it's run by a toothless inbred, from the outside. However, I now realize that HE might actually sit down with me and talk shop. Not like these useless corporate posers that call themselves a premier dealership. I am 100% done with them.

Thanks for listening.
-MIKE

you sound like a two-year old throwing a fit. why would a dealer want to show/or sell you any more than stock parts? why would you expect a dealer to know more than oem specs/application? im sure stihl training techs don't get on this site and look for modding tips. if you came in my store acting like that i would gladly show you the door, and tell you not to come back. if you are such a big builder/modder, then you should know what parts will interchange with other powerheads. what a waste of a thread..............

 

[sachsmo]

Have I been to your shop?

 

[mountainlake]

In this case your the one with a problem getting pissed off cuz they aren't into modding saws. Steve

 

[mountainlake]

you sound like a two-year old throwing a fit.

Like +10

 

[anymanusa]

I read your story, and I gotta agree with spacemule. I don't even see where the rub is. So some jackwad behind a counter was a ####. It seems that way every time I go into any one of the various dealerships that are close to me. Get over it. He doesn't know about modifying saws and doesn't give a #### to know about it or help you with your scenario.

 

[STIHLTHEDEERE]

have i been to your shop?

unless you use/purchase caterpiller equipmnet i doubt it

 

[spike60]

Spacemule is 100% correct in his earlier posts.

The OP has unrealistic expectations, a short fuse, and very little saw knowledge. Basically an immature fool prone to flipping out with little provocation. (As his reaction to this post will no doubt confirm) Peeling out of the lot, unloading on the guy in ShopRite and then your wife? J-E-R-K!

Can't think of many dealers that would be happy to see you arrive, no matter how much coffee and donuts you bring with you. Especially a guy who buys the expensive stuff online, and pesters the dealer for nickel and dime parts and free advice.

Only a REALLY good saw shop with a VERY experienced tech could have a conversation about modding saws. It would have to be a place where there's some enthusiasm for saw performance beyond the usual "we just sell 'em the way they are" lawn and garden store. There's not too many of them out there. Sure there are plenty of moronic dealers, but just because a shop isn't into performance tuning or "playing" with saws, it doesn't brand them as idiots. There are plenty of real good shops that are pretty much "by the book". It's not fair to knock them because they don't share our enthusiast perspective on chainsaws.

 

[Guido Salvage]

Let me preface this by saying I stopped reading the individual posts prior to the end of the first page. I do not see how the OP whining and complaining about the local dealer is going to help him in achieving his goals. Any dealer operation has a certain set of rules to operate by in order to maintain their franchise and that is what will drive their business practices.

My suggestion would be to talk to people who have actually done what you are seeking to do rather than relying on factory technicians. Once you know what parts you need then order them from the dealer by the individual part numbers without reference to their application. Far more will be learned and accomplished by doing that than by complaining about businesses following the rules.