spacemule
The Peanut Gallery
Care to elaborate? Do tell.Ekka said:Sort of shot yourself in the foot have you?
Neighbors Killing My Trees (with ??)
- Thread starter genesutton
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genesutton
ArboristSite Lurker
treeseer If I knew how to post a picture of the area in ?? I would do that. How do you do that on this site??? Gene
Ekka
Addicted to ArboristSite
Perhaps us Aussies aren't as politically correct as you, substitute what ever words you like, even for the lowlife, but it's only the facts that have been mentioned. Should that constitute whining then too bad, I wouldn't give a hoot. I'd even see if the local paper would run a story. This guy moves out to acreage to enjoy his land, his way.
I'm far from mentally unstable, and quite the contrary, and yes, the tone should be of some-one determined to get to the bottom of the issue prepared to put their money where their mouth is. He is the victim. And the neighbor needs to feel the heat.
I bet it would be a totally different issue if it were a dog or cat etc that was baited, but because it's a tree that's not as serious but does involve trespassing to cause malicious damage, malicious damage furthering to hazardous and dangerous environment to the landowner who then has to alleviate the hazard at his cost.
What has it cost the land owner already? Not to mention any emotional stress suffered. These were planted trees with a specific purpose not remnant forest.
Should proceedings only lead to fine and slap on the wrist with no restitution or compensation the landowner could then follow that up with civil action for compensation ... and he'd win hands down.
One council over here took severe action against a group of unit holders in a complex that was overlooking the bay. They posted huge placards and newspaper ads with rewards to get the people who poisoned a heap of trees for view of the bay ... cut a long story short they erected a huge billboard painted out with murals totally screening out the view of the bay for those units, cost them over $50,000 and although no-one was prosecuted due to lack of evidence they considered justice served to the culprits.
Perhaps if the neighbor had approached genesutton with his problems something could have transpired, but the way this neighbor has taken upon himself to do as he pleases with some-one else's property goes a lot deeper than just poisoning trees.
I personally had issues with my neighbors tree, invited them over for a BBQ, we had a chat about the problems and they agreed to cut it down which I did for no charge ... that's the way it should go. If they didn't agree to cut it down I would have tried to prune, if they flat out dug in and wouldn't touch it I'd have to search for other options.
And I'm allowed my opinion, if you don't like it too bad.
I'm far from mentally unstable, and quite the contrary, and yes, the tone should be of some-one determined to get to the bottom of the issue prepared to put their money where their mouth is. He is the victim. And the neighbor needs to feel the heat.
I bet it would be a totally different issue if it were a dog or cat etc that was baited, but because it's a tree that's not as serious but does involve trespassing to cause malicious damage, malicious damage furthering to hazardous and dangerous environment to the landowner who then has to alleviate the hazard at his cost.
What has it cost the land owner already? Not to mention any emotional stress suffered. These were planted trees with a specific purpose not remnant forest.
Should proceedings only lead to fine and slap on the wrist with no restitution or compensation the landowner could then follow that up with civil action for compensation ... and he'd win hands down.
One council over here took severe action against a group of unit holders in a complex that was overlooking the bay. They posted huge placards and newspaper ads with rewards to get the people who poisoned a heap of trees for view of the bay ... cut a long story short they erected a huge billboard painted out with murals totally screening out the view of the bay for those units, cost them over $50,000 and although no-one was prosecuted due to lack of evidence they considered justice served to the culprits.
Perhaps if the neighbor had approached genesutton with his problems something could have transpired, but the way this neighbor has taken upon himself to do as he pleases with some-one else's property goes a lot deeper than just poisoning trees.
I personally had issues with my neighbors tree, invited them over for a BBQ, we had a chat about the problems and they agreed to cut it down which I did for no charge ... that's the way it should go. If they didn't agree to cut it down I would have tried to prune, if they flat out dug in and wouldn't touch it I'd have to search for other options.
And I'm allowed my opinion, if you don't like it too bad.
Click go advanced and then click manage attachment. Make sure to format the pits befor posting if they are to big it will not work. Only 5 at a time per post also. Good luck. Use the deer cam and catch the dude red handed. Read earlier post on deer cam I left you.
erob914
ArboristSite Member
I believe a little poison ivy might go a long way in this case. Can bullet ants survive in your area? They didnt earn their name for nothing. They are all natural and work for free.
spacemule
The Peanut Gallery
I agree with your opinion, I just don't think that letter would be effective. Consider that "The one in question must have and I really think their encouraged by the others down the line were their views were blocked by houses." So, now we have at least part of his audience already against him. Are they going to respond well to a preaching, condescending letter, or are they going to laugh because it's obvious he's upset?Ekka said:
He also mentions problems with the views of some other neighbors. Are they likely to sympathize with the killing of these trees? I don't thinks so. In my experience, the best weapon with these types of folks is kindness. Act like you're on they're side, and you're trying your best to come up with a compromise, that sort of thing. Don't accuse (do we actually know which neighbor poisoned the trees? sounds questionable), rather act like you're involving them in the process of finding who did this. If all else fails, build a barn.
Don't ever let them see anger or resentment--that's what they want. This is my opinion.genesutton
ArboristSite Lurker
Here are the pictures, hope they make it. The first is my neighbor in ?. Second is (left) looking at other neighbors. Third is the old oak.
The main reason I posted here was in hopes of gathering info. of what types of chemicals or what ever might have been used. It looks like there's a wide verity. Again any info. is appreciated, and Thank You for what's been posted. Gene
The main reason I posted here was in hopes of gathering info. of what types of chemicals or what ever might have been used. It looks like there's a wide verity. Again any info. is appreciated, and Thank You for what's been posted. Gene
Ekka
Addicted to ArboristSite
Good pics, well done.
Pretty obvious, the guys certainly pretty game to do that.
Pretty obvious, the guys certainly pretty game to do that.
fubar2
Addicted to ArboristSite
I had a somewhat similiar experience with some fifty yr old chinese chestnut trees. The new neighbors wife didnt like the smell of the blossems, cant say as i blame her and anybody whos been downwind of em will attest to that. The second spring after they moved in eight of the trees started dieing. Ive no proof but know in my mind what happened to em. In your case its pretty obvious after seeing the pic, like Rambo said, he drew first blood. Do not allow him to get away with it. If nothing else erect a billboard with the message to save killer whales or anthrax spores any stupid thing you can think of. Good luck to ya and remember"vengenance shall be mine sayeth the lord". What i mean is let him know that you know and do not intend to allow him to get away with it.
Jim1NZ
ArboristSite Guru
The only way to hammer them in court is to to catch them red handed - video camera as said earlier.
Document everything!!!!!! When it happens, what happened etc, that is if you want to go down the court road.
I dont think its worth it for the populars, too much time, effort and money is spent.
I think you should...
Consult the poisoner (house whos view is blocked), try to be nice even though you want to deck him. Find a tree species you can both settle on. Plant the trees and be done with it once and for good.
I think you will find the more you dig your toes in, the more they will.
Take pictures of the healthy oak now!
Document everything!!!!!! When it happens, what happened etc, that is if you want to go down the court road.
I dont think its worth it for the populars, too much time, effort and money is spent.
I think you should...
Consult the poisoner (house whos view is blocked), try to be nice even though you want to deck him. Find a tree species you can both settle on. Plant the trees and be done with it once and for good.
I think you will find the more you dig your toes in, the more they will.
Take pictures of the healthy oak now!
Kneejerk Bombas
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I can see why the neighbor wouldn't want those trees!
Good pics, seem to show room for compromise plantings. Spreading trees like maple planted on either side of their view, evergreens behind the dead trees that can be trained below their sightline but still screen the lower half of their house.
You've got a big cleared area there; yes they did wrong with the poison but the barn idea seems mean too.
Nice oak; how are you managing it?
You've got a big cleared area there; yes they did wrong with the poison but the barn idea seems mean too.
Nice oak; how are you managing it?
MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
Mike Maas said:
That's a fact! It's a shame the two neighbors couldn't work things out. Perhaps a different tree, not as tall? Sheesh!
Chris J.
Addicted to ArboristSite
If you & the trees were there first,
before he purchased the property & built his house, then he should've worked with you on a compromise. If a compromise couldn't be reached, even if (please notice the if) you were the difficult one, he has no right to poison your trees. Of course it would be helpful if you could prove it.
Are the remaining trees salvageable, & can you legally fence them off? Even though that certainly wouldn't stop someone determined to poison the trees. Maybe a compromise on some different trees, preferably at his complete expense, with compensation for your original trees? Is it possible to maintain both your privacy & his view?
If your neighbor is sneeking in to poison your trees, it doesn't sound like a compromise will ever be workable. I'm not so sure that legal action will deter someone that low. Be ready to fight fire with fire; that is the only thing that some people understand.
I'm speaking as a homeowner here. Of course without knowing your neighbor or you I have no way of knowing; just guessing. The tree care pros who have been involved with similar situations may have a whole different take on the situation.
before he purchased the property & built his house, then he should've worked with you on a compromise. If a compromise couldn't be reached, even if (please notice the if) you were the difficult one, he has no right to poison your trees. Of course it would be helpful if you could prove it.
Are the remaining trees salvageable, & can you legally fence them off? Even though that certainly wouldn't stop someone determined to poison the trees. Maybe a compromise on some different trees, preferably at his complete expense, with compensation for your original trees? Is it possible to maintain both your privacy & his view?
If your neighbor is sneeking in to poison your trees, it doesn't sound like a compromise will ever be workable. I'm not so sure that legal action will deter someone that low. Be ready to fight fire with fire; that is the only thing that some people understand.
I'm speaking as a homeowner here. Of course without knowing your neighbor or you I have no way of knowing; just guessing. The tree care pros who have been involved with similar situations may have a whole different take on the situation.
Wouldn't it be ironic if the neighbor drilled the injection holes on *your side of the trees, and then when you file suit, he returns with a suit of "intentional infliction." The dead trees are now on your property, but now when they fall, as they eventually must, they could hurt somebody on his side of the line! So, you are maintaining a potential hazard with threatens quiet enjoyment of the family tomato garden, or whatever, his deck and so forth.
Electric fence with notices etc., remove the dead trees, and replant. He has no right to demand, or equivalently cause, you to maintian his view across your property. Next thing he's going to want is an easement to shoot bullets across your property.
Electric fence with notices etc., remove the dead trees, and replant. He has no right to demand, or equivalently cause, you to maintian his view across your property. Next thing he's going to want is an easement to shoot bullets across your property.
It would be really ironic if the trees fell on his house.
genesutton,
Do you have a dog? Maybe a dog would alert you to his tresspassing, although it looks like he might have done the damage from his own property. It sounds like he isn't willing to compromise. That would involve him admitting guilt in a criminal act. Too bad the whole situation couldn't have been avoided with the BBQ solution suggested earlier.
genesutton,
Do you have a dog? Maybe a dog would alert you to his tresspassing, although it looks like he might have done the damage from his own property. It sounds like he isn't willing to compromise. That would involve him admitting guilt in a criminal act. Too bad the whole situation couldn't have been avoided with the BBQ solution suggested earlier.
Mange
Addicted to ArboristSite
Could it simply be a water problem?
if he drained the ground there, the tree, get no moisture to draw water from and get Dependant on rain to fall, if the wind and sun is from your naiburs way, That could do the trick, without additives.
no water, no life.
Set out a couple sprinklers and see.....
If nothing else he will get wet trying to knock them off.
if he drained the ground there, the tree, get no moisture to draw water from and get Dependant on rain to fall, if the wind and sun is from your naiburs way, That could do the trick, without additives.
no water, no life.
Set out a couple sprinklers and see.....
If nothing else he will get wet trying to knock them off.
gumneck
Addicted to ArboristSite
Seems likely from the pics neighbor hit em with a herbicide or other plant killing chemical. Doesn't matter that his view of sunset was reduced by the trees presence or who was there first, the neighbor had no legal or moral right to destroy another person's property. I dont necessarily like the look of that A-frame structure bay window jutting out the back of his house but I couldn't go over there & change it.
If it were me, I would take the money I wanted to use to pay a lawyer to get some justice and build a 3 story garage at least as wide as his house using full 8 ft 2x4's(not precut studs). Then I would advertise both upper levels in the local paper free rental space to " aspiring newly formed garage bands ".
:angel:
If it were me, I would take the money I wanted to use to pay a lawyer to get some justice and build a 3 story garage at least as wide as his house using full 8 ft 2x4's(not precut studs). Then I would advertise both upper levels in the local paper free rental space to " aspiring newly formed garage bands ".
:angel:
Mr Sutton,
Do you have any photos of the injection holes? Did the arborist and Ag agent do any work on cross sectioning a hole? If so, they could definitely tell if it had been drilled. Drilling to inject herbicides is slow and unnecessary. The easy way is to smack the tree with a hatchet and give the notch a squirt of herbicide. Easier still is just to sprinkle some granules around the base of the tree(s).
The symptoms can help to narrow the possibilities of the material used. From what you have already stated, it is probabably a photosynthetic inhibitor and maybe a broadleaved herbicide. Is there any damage to any surrounding vegetation such as grass and weeds? If the material were injected it can leach into the. It may not kill it but it may cause leaves to be distorted or mottled. You can also check for residues in the soil with sensitive plant such as tomatoes. They are cheap and you can plant a few around the dead trees. If there are herbicide residues in the soil, they will show. Be sure to document the symptoms.
If he is continuing to poison the trees, he may be making it easier for you if he is not changing material. Photograph the trees each week including closeups of the foilage so that you can tell what changes occur and how long it takes for them to be visible. Weekly photographs may help you to distinguish subtle differences that are not noticed until they are significant.
The chemical company's representative may be your best help in narrowing the possiblities. They do not want their products misused because of the public image it presents. They may even test the soil at no charge.
Do you have any photos of the injection holes? Did the arborist and Ag agent do any work on cross sectioning a hole? If so, they could definitely tell if it had been drilled. Drilling to inject herbicides is slow and unnecessary. The easy way is to smack the tree with a hatchet and give the notch a squirt of herbicide. Easier still is just to sprinkle some granules around the base of the tree(s).
The symptoms can help to narrow the possibilities of the material used. From what you have already stated, it is probabably a photosynthetic inhibitor and maybe a broadleaved herbicide. Is there any damage to any surrounding vegetation such as grass and weeds? If the material were injected it can leach into the. It may not kill it but it may cause leaves to be distorted or mottled. You can also check for residues in the soil with sensitive plant such as tomatoes. They are cheap and you can plant a few around the dead trees. If there are herbicide residues in the soil, they will show. Be sure to document the symptoms.
If he is continuing to poison the trees, he may be making it easier for you if he is not changing material. Photograph the trees each week including closeups of the foilage so that you can tell what changes occur and how long it takes for them to be visible. Weekly photographs may help you to distinguish subtle differences that are not noticed until they are significant.
The chemical company's representative may be your best help in narrowing the possiblities. They do not want their products misused because of the public image it presents. They may even test the soil at no charge.
gumneck
Addicted to ArboristSite
Does it have to injection holes or hatchet hacks??
I have a micron herbi that I feel confident I could wipe out a tree in about 1 minute(probably take less time than that). I'm sure I could see the results within a week. Also feel like a simple garden pump tank sprayer could do it as well and I wouldn't have to trespass. Catch the wind right, a wave here a waft there. Mix it at 33% and those trees would be crispy.
I have a micron herbi that I feel confident I could wipe out a tree in about 1 minute(probably take less time than that). I'm sure I could see the results within a week. Also feel like a simple garden pump tank sprayer could do it as well and I wouldn't have to trespass. Catch the wind right, a wave here a waft there. Mix it at 33% and those trees would be crispy.
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