Super 2 oil line question

[flatsfisher]

I was trying to get this saw running with advice from this thread but got caught up 3 months ago with working on other saws. my bench is now clear and I'm back at it. when I left off here, I had a saw that would not run or even fire unless I dribbled fuel in the carb. then it would run and even rev up for a few seconds and die. I put in a carb kit which did not help.

 

[flatsfisher]

reed is good., spark is good, compression is good. after letting it sit and thinking about it, I decided to check the check valve in the carb with the suck and blow on a tube method. the check valve was not working. I ordered and installed a walbro check valve kit and now it passes the test. after re-assembling the saw, it fired right up without priming but was not running great and would only run with the choke almost closed. would not even come close to idling. as I had rebuilt the carb and been in it twice, went to the pressure and vacuum test.

 

[flatsfisher]

would not even come close to building up pressure or vacuum. took the oil pump off and plugged this hole and it held 9 psi for over an hour while I had lunch without moving at all.

 

[flatsfisher]

leaks pressure and vacuum like a fire hose at this hole. anyone know why?

 

[flatsfisher]

these got a little torn up removing them. when I finally got it running using the choke it was oiling well at the bar pad. got all over the floor. there is another gasket, they sandwich the plunger diaphragm but the other one got wrecked in removal. hoping I can get these parts.

 

[heimannm]

Gasket is 69244-1

Plunger is A-12356-B

if that helps at all.

Try Leon's https://www.leonschainsawpartsandrepair.com/store/c1/Featured_Products.html.

Mark Heimann

 

[flatsfisher]

thanks Mark. the IPL I have is so fuzzy I could only guess at the numbers.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I've rebuilt several of those, you can get by without using the diaphragm if you seal it off good so it doesn't leak, bypass the diaphragm by running a line from the engine crankcase to the oil tank with the duckbill valve in the tank at the top hole. The bottom hole has the tank line running from the filter at the bottom of the tank to the bar pad. Block off all the other nozzles and holes. There is a different version of that engine that doesn't have that diaphragm which is easier to work with..

 

[flatsfisher]

well, he has the gaskets but not the plunger listed on his site. I sent him an email. don't see it on ebay either or a google search.

 

[flatsfisher]

I've rebuilt several of those, you can get by without using the diaphragm if you seal it off good so it doesn't leak, bypass the diaphragm by running a line from the engine crankcase to the oil tank with the duckbill valve in the tank at the top hole. The bottom hole has the tank line running from the filter at the bottom of the tank to the bar pad. Block off all the other nozzles and holes. There is a different version of that engine that doesn't have that diaphragm which is easier to work with..

thanks for the info. where are you tapping into the crankcase?

 

[heimannm]

If I have it right, the yellow line is the impulse signal from the crankcase to the oil tank...the duckbill valve in the oil tank allows the signal to pressurize the tank and force oil out the red line to the plunger, the oil from the plunger (also operated by an impulse signal) meters the oil out to the bar.

The older saws did not have the plunger system so the lines went from the crankcase to the oil tank, from the oil tank to the bar. When you shut the saw down you have to remember to crack the cap on the oil tank and burp the system or it will continue to push oil out to the bar as the saw is just sitting.

There is supposed to be a short piece of sintered metal between the impulse line and the duckbill valve in the oil tank. You can regulate the pressure in the tank by exposing more (less pressure) or less (more pressure) of the sintered connector.



Hopefully a p jr. will respond but I believe you would plug the red and green lines above, maybe even just run a hose between those two fittings, but I think you also need to make a new, solid gasket to go where the plunger is currently as there is an impulse signal to that device as well.

Mark

 

[flatsfisher]

orange is the impulse pressurizing line. green brings oil from the tank to the pump. blue sends oil from the pump to the bar pad.

 

[flatsfisher]

so put a solid gasket in lieu of the plunger and stock gaskets, run the line with green arrow to the bar pad fitting, plug off the fitting with the blue arrow and delete that line.

assume this was the pressure relief hole for the plunger diaphragm and it would be blanked off by the solid gasket and would not need to be plugged.

 

[flatsfisher]

assume everything circled would be removed for this mod?

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Okay, you have crankcase pressure in the place where the diaphragm was. Just run a line from where the diaphragm was to the top of the tank like is pictured by Flatfisher and block the other lines off, run a line from the lower tank hole directly to the bar plate and the other end to the bottom of the tank with the little filter on the end in the tank. Block everything else off. Leave the diaphragms out but seal up the housing so it won't leak. The little hole that you blocked off should remain blocked. I didn't mention the sintered iron piece because they're very hard to find. I just use a tube from a ball point pen, cut to about a half inch to connect the duckbill to the hose. It oils a bit too much this way but at least it works and you should loosen the oil cap when you're done cutting. If it oils way too much just loosen the cap a small amount or drill a very small hole in the cap, almost the size of a straight pin.

 

[Mikael]

One experiment that might be worth trying is to block the atmospheric vent hole in the cover, with a piece of round stock rubber or similar. That would seal the leak, if it is the diaphragm that is leaking. Leave everything else as it is. Test run and see if the saw is running correctly.
Theoretically it might not oil because of the blocked vent hole. But who knows. Maybe it oils a bit.
If the saw runs well but doesn't oil, then just reroute the lower oil hose from the tank directly to the bar. As it is on the pressurised systems. And block the two nipples on the pump to prevent dirt to enter.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

assume everything circled would be removed for this mod?

View attachment 1037147

Yes, not really needed. The oiler works on crankcase pressure which pushes the oil out of the tank to the bar pad. The duckbill valve prevents negative pressure (suction) from entering the tank. The tank must be air tight for this to work. If it works too well of course you can lessen the pressure by loosening the cap a slight bit, or drilling the cap, as I stated earlier. That's as well as I can explain it..

 

[a. palmer jr.]

thanks for the info. where are you tapping into the crankcase?

Tapping into the crankcase at the nozzle coming from the same place it did before. Leave the inner holes where the diaphragm was unblocked and seal the cover with Dirko or something similar. Block the two nozzles going to the bar pad lines and run one line instead of two. Also, block the hole in the diaphragm cover (blue arrow). After sealer dries you might want to do another pressure test on the engine to make sure it still holds about 7 psi.

 

[flatsfisher]

well, I did the conversion as discussed. could not get parts 16, 17 and 18 out but I don't think it matters. this saw will not run properly. there is no air leak now but still requires half choke to run, badly and it won't idle. getting a little frustrated. thought getting rid of the air leak would fix this. I ran it badly several times and no bar oil came out either. but, that's the least of the problems.

 

[flatsfisher]