Why In Spanish?

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Since you bring Canada into the Equation I'll comment some...

I would think Canadians might just stay home and earn more, which is generally what happens in Canada, much higher wages then the USA for standard jobs. More unions and a socialist approach to governance see to that.

in so far as unions they are the better by far of two evils, the other being corporate greed and those who drive that bus.

I was at an engagement party luncheon for one of my close friend's daughters about a year ago. It started at about 1pm and most people were gone by 3:30 or so, but I stayed for a few drinks with a couple of the other guests.

At about 4:30, after 2.5 hours of solid drinking, one of the guys stood up and said that he had to leave. I objected, as he bought the last two rounds, and I wanted to repay the favor. He kindly refused the drink, and explained that he had to go back to work at the Chrysler plant to punch out his time card! Turns out he had been "at work" all day.

BELIEVE ME, as a born-and-bred native of Detroit, unions are NOT the way to go. Across many industries and labor groups, unions have destroyed the American worker in a way that has made it possible for the illegal foreign workers to become "attractive" to hiring companies.

While working at a State University, I befriended a carpenter who was repairing the drop ceilings in one of my buildings. On the fourth day of the five day project, I asked him if he did side jobs. He said that he did. I then asked him how long the job would have taken if he was doing it "on the side". He said that he could do the job in 10 hours. He explained that he couldn't do the job any faster at the university because his union "brothers" would retaliate against him for setting too high a standard.

My grandfather is a retired GM foreman. He has had union workers who would show up late o work, and drunk or high, on a regular basis. Not only could he not punish them, but GM had to pay for the worker to take several weeks off of work, and pay for their rehab!

I have seen, first hand, "union apartments". These nifty little sanctuaries are built high in the warehouses of the Big 3. They are furnished, and many have card tables and TVs. The workers will use the break room for their scheduled breaks, and then retire to the "Union Apartment" for a couple hours of post-lunch relaxation (on the clock, of course).

To this day, the workers that I have hired who have Union history are the laziest, tardiest, slowest, whiniest, "sickliest" guys around, and they are totally shocked when I send them packing without their graduated punishment curriculum (verbal warning, written warning, 1 day off, 3 days off, 5 days off, fired).

There was a time when the American worker was second to none. The unionization of these people, while originally necessary and beneficial, has become a cancer, destroying the motivation, work ethic, and employability of the very people it was meant to protect.

Getting back on topic: If you want to reduce the employability of illegal aliens, unionize them. They will quickly learn to work slower, whine more, be less punctual, and expect alot more money.
 
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almost 100% true man. i am sure there are the hard workers here and there in a union but the rate they demand and the effort put in is absurd. plain and simple.

cant tell how many times ive driven by a union crew with 5 guys watching 1 guy work.

i know the main goal to "get yours" but does it have to be me me me all the time?
 
OK, Look the thread topic is why in Spanish? Why do we as Americans need, should learn it? If I have to be Bi-lingual to accomadate someone what need/want will there be for them to learn English?

Re-read Post #59. They are not trying to get you to learn Spanish or speak it. They are just making information available in both languages.

I'll agree that illegals doing work on any job, in any country will hurt the field that they are working in, however you should not assume that the Spanish "reading" members are illegal.

Trying very hard to stick to the thread topic and not get sidetracked.
 
simple its not about safety,its all about money the big companies that put the Spanish on our American stuff are the same people who bring them here!!!! now there is so many here after many yrs of bringing em over that a lot of em have money and business in our country. big company's dont care about nothing but green and if printing label's can sell more stuff they will do it. O don't forget these Spanish co,s will never hire anyone not of there kind. i think most countries and people are racist. only big business in America has an open mind when it comes to making money.
 
Geez, some of you get your undies in a bundle easy.

The US government is complicent in the illegal worker thing, they have a "Individual tax code" or the like as a substitute for an SSN.

I do not know how it is where the dissenters are, but here in the MKE metro area it is very hard to fill a labor position with a white person. There is an assumption that they should not have to put up with an entry level wage. Skilled people may move around, but most start their own company.

As for the thing about this was always an English speaking country, that has been true only til around WWI, when national unity forced it on the germanic/franco/whatever communities there were prior to that.

What about the Spanish speaking populations that were in the Southwest prior to the Gringos stealing the land form them? Many of them fought against the so called Mexican Empire with the Texans, only to get screwed by the whiteman.

There is a joke thats been a round for a while

Poly lingual is for a person who speaks many languages, take Belgins who speak at French German and Dutch along with some English.

Bilinguals speak two languages, like many of the amigos that are getting lambasted her.

WHat is the word for a people that speak only one language? American, and darned proud of it you pinko, bleeding heart, liberal....

Why learn Spanish? So you know what they are saying behind your back :laugh:
 
Our UK government doesn't keep records of people entering and leaving the country:jawdrop: estimates vary but the thinking is we have over 1 million ilegals in the UK, last year we opened the EU flood gates [anyone from Europe can live anywhere in Europe as long as they are members of the European Union] the best part of 3million ''poor'' Europeans decended on to our shores!

No wonder our country looks like its heading for recession, and wages haven't gone up in years
 
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unions

To this day, the workers that I have hired who have Union history are the laziest, tardiest, slowest, whiniest, "sickliest" guys around, and they are totally shocked when I send them packing without their graduated punishment curriculum (verbal warning, written warning, 1 day off, 3 days off, 5 days off, fired).

Won't side track the thread for long; That is why I said unions are the better of two evils.

Back on topic: Not trying to be overally philosophical, however, every marginalized group eventually wants what the rest of their society has so as important as what we do or don't do with them is what they will do. They are likely in the best position to address the issues you are facing.
 
What a dynamic thread!

Can't say I didn't see it coming. Read the whole thing.

Anywise...

Why in Spanish?

Why not?

If we weren't in the death throws of this whole Illegal Immigrunt thing, would it matter so much?

Simple fact is, despite this underlying issue, we need communication.

I see good points from both sides of this issue, but the things I read about concerning the events surrounding it gives me little to no hope towards any relief. This coupled with other, shall we say, current global events leaves me looking all the more so at the only Government I can trust, not the Government that seeks a one world order, but the One that will accomplish it in perfect time. That being the Lord's.

On a side note, it is interesting to me that a country that boasts, in God we Trust, does so little to prove it, nor strive according to His principles. Or is their another god these days? god Money?

I see two overwhelming entities at work in this arena: Greed and Fear.

Meanwhile, back to my everyday experience. Since I personally can't do anything to stop the influx all by myself, I have to deal with it...and do so according to the principles I see as best, regardless of the time period, regardless of the situation. Sort of like an anchor, or a Rock, that gives a peace in the storm, even if that storm brings down a relatively recent empire foolish and prideful in its youth and illusion of power, regardless if I once loved and served it exclusively. Yet, as I'm still an American, I love and serve another Kingdom more so. It has been around alot longer and looks to be a sure bet for the future. This is where two worlds collide. What will be the witness thereof? What can I bring from one world to be a positive influence on another in the midst of such chaos?

There are still some good things left here in America to be had, though it is not what it once was. One of which is my freedom to allow my faith to be a blessing to strangers, the poor, the weak, and the downtrodden.

The plight of our forefathers that led to invasion and immigration of this land is not unlike those of present..how soon we selectively forget and replace with our own version of history. In fact, in some ways it was much more shameful. See the true American History.

In this light, I see my fellow man.

I just recently worked with some of these Spanish speaking tree workers at the ice storms of the midwest. I see where they lack, I see were they might kill themselves, someone else, or me. I see where they work hard...not harder.

I see a need for communication.

They understood very little English, I know and understand a little Spanish. (what I remember from high school daze)

We got though seven very interesting days. I worked very closely with one Sergio. Late thirties, early forties?

Honestly, I had to force myself to see past the paradigms and prejudices that I'm lambasted with on a daily basis. It was a test. Who gave it?

I ate my lunch one day, cold and soaked in the chipper box of my own truck while Sergio sat in my cab. That was a tuffy, but I had compassion. I waited patiently until we were finished and took my turn to warm up and dry out. No biggie.

I put up with him taking my saw to go groundpound. (It's a good thing I know how to use a file.) I didn't deal with this so well, but I got past it.

Next thing I know, I'm deployed with him and his saw to go clear the line. That was a trip, but I learned to communicate and a need for better communication and training. We got through it, even if I had to take the saw and teach him something on occasion.

I had breaks in between working with him, but it was like he was always popping up around me and my crew. Maybe somebody saw my and my crew's compassion and willingness and ability to work with him in a positive fashion.

I found myself doing a little groundpounding with him, fixing his saw, helping him out in general. I learned a little more Spanish. For example, I asked him, pointed at my saw and said: “en español?" Stuff like that. He kinda lit up that I would even care to know.

I found myself looking out for this guy, swinging saws together (not too close), getting the real dangerous trees down and letting him grow in practice with the smaller and safer ones.

Yeah, he kinda grew on me. Last day in Oklahoma, we were cutting big weeds in a good snowfall. It's near dusk and we are bringing it in and counting heads because they were going to fire up the lines. There was no room in my truck for Sergio. There he was standing out in the cold just as wet, cold, and tired as me. He worked all day long while even some white boys were too busy looking for ways to stay warm, dry, and rested. Well I couldn't stand to let him freeze like that as hard as he worked, so I grabbed a spare hat and gloves, gave him a place to warm up while I pulled our chains off the tires and we made it to the rally point with four crushed in the front cause nobody would take the time to go out of their way to come get him.

I like Sergio. I care about the man. Why in Spanish...why not?

I took a factory job years ago and quit because it was all Spanish on my shift save a black guy that called me the Doctor because of the way I operated a fork truck and managed to load so many trucks right off the production lines. Oh and one French guy.

I asked why do I have to learn Spanish...this is America, teach them English!

They told me that it was easier (because I was educated) and cheaper (I'm one, they are many) to teach me Spanish than to teach them all English. True, but I still quit on general principle. I wish I hadn't.

In practical reality, it's easier and safer to print material in Spanish than to wait till they learn enough English, though I still believe it is in their best interest to learn English. Meanwhile, it might not hurt for me to ditch some foolish pride and pick up a little Spanish.

Knowledge is what? My people are destroyed for lack of what?

Like it or not the more equipped we are to negotiate the real world obstacles ahead of us, the better our chances of survival and success.

Whether that be learning languages or following principles of a higher power, even if it doesn't make sense, perhaps especially when it doesn't make sense. Maybe that's the logical answer to a seemingly illogical situation.

One that has been given a deaf ear to by too many in this hour.

Does this mean I believe that the issue is beyond criticism? No, constructive criticism in open forums and the arena of ideals is always welcome. It is a problem, we must be patient for solutions. In the meantime, we must adapt and overcome what is coming at us in society and in the industry whether it speaks Spanish or not. You either find a way to swim or get washed away.

I'm sticking around, I love trees more than the huggers. I'll teach that and more in any language.

Feliz Navidad!
 
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What a dynamic thread!

Can't say I didn't see it coming. Read the whole thing.

Anywise...

Why in Spanish?

Why not?

If we weren't in the death throws of this whole Illegal Immigrunt thing, would it matter so much?

Simple fact is, despite this underlying issue, we need communication.

I see good points from both sides of this issue, but the things I read about concerning the events surrounding it gives me little to no hope towards any relief. This coupled with other, shall we say, current global events leaves me looking all the more so at the only Government I can trust, not the Government that seeks a one world order, but the One that will accomplish it in perfect time. That being the Lord's.

On a side note, it is interesting to me that a country that boasts, in God we Trust, does so little to prove it, nor strive according to His principles. Or is their another god these days? god Money?

I see two overwhelming entities at work in this arena: Greed and Fear.

Meanwhile, back to my everyday experience. Since I personally can't do anything to stop the influx all by myself, I have to deal with it...and do so according to the principles I see as best, regardless of the time period, regardless of the situation. Sort of like an anchor, or a Rock, that gives a peace in the storm, even if that storm brings down a relatively recent empire foolish and prideful in its youth and illusion of power, regardless if I once loved and served it exclusively. Yet, as I'm still an American, I love and serve another Kingdom more so. It has been around alot longer and looks to be a sure bet for the future. This is where two worlds collide. What will be the witness thereof? What can I bring from one world to be a positive influence on another in the midst of such chaos?

There are still some good things left here in America to be had, though it is not what it once was. One of which is my freedom to allow my faith to be a blessing to strangers, the poor, the weak, and the downtrodden.

The plight of our forefathers that led to invasion and immigration of this land is not unlike those of present..how soon we selectively forget and replace with our own version of history. In fact, in some ways it was much more shameful. See the true American History.

In this light, I see my fellow man.

I just recently worked with some of these Spanish speaking tree workers at the ice storms of the midwest. I see where they lack, I see were they might kill themselves, someone else, or me. I see where they work hard...not harder.

I see a need for communication.

They understood very little English, I know and understand a little Spanish. (what I remember from high school daze)

We got though seven very interesting days. I worked very closely with one Sergio. Late thirties, early forties?

Honestly, I had to force myself to see past the paradigms and prejudices that I'm lambasted with on a daily basis. It was a test. Who gave it?

I ate my lunch one day, cold and soaked in the chipper box of my own truck while Sergio sat in my cab. That was a tuffy, but I had compassion. I waited patiently until we were finished and took my turn to warm up and dry out. No biggie.

I put up with him taking my saw to go groundpound. (It's a good thing I know how to use a file.) I didn't deal with this so well, but I got past it.

Next thing I know, I'm deployed with him and his saw to go clear the line. That was a trip, but I learned to communicate and a need for better communication and training. We got through it, even if I had to take the saw and teach him something on occasion.

I had breaks in between working with him, but it was like he was always popping up around me and my crew. Maybe somebody saw my and my crew's compassion and willingness and ability to work with him in a positive fashion.

I found myself doing a little groundpounding with him, fixing his saw, helping him out in general. I learned a little more Spanish. For example, I asked him, pointed at my saw and said: “en español?" Stuff like that. He kinda lit up that I would even care to know.

I found myself looking out for this guy, swinging saws together (not too close), getting the real dangerous trees down and letting him grow in practice with the smaller and safer ones.

Yeah, he kinda grew on me. Last day in Oklahoma, we were cutting big weeds in a good snowfall. It's near dusk and we are bringing it in and counting heads because they were going to fire up the lines. There was no room in my truck for Sergio. There he was standing out in the cold just as wet, cold, and tired as me. He worked all day long while even some white boys were too busy looking for ways to stay warm, dry, and rested. Well I couldn't stand to let him freeze like that as hard as he worked, so I grabbed a spare hat and gloves, gave him a place to warm up while I pulled our chains off the tires and we made it to the rally point with four crushed in the front cause nobody would take the time to go out of their way to come get him.

I like Sergio. I care about the man. Why in Spanish...why not?

I took a factory job years ago and quit because it was all Spanish on my shift save a black guy that called me the Doctor because of the way I operated a fork truck and managed to load so many trucks right off the production lines. Oh and one French guy.

I asked why do I have to learn Spanish...this is America, teach them English!

They told me that it was easier (because I was educated) and cheaper (I'm one, they are many) to teach me Spanish than to teach them all English. True, but I still quit on general principle. I wish I hadn't.

In practical reality, it's easier and safer to print material in Spanish than to wait till they learn enough English, though I still believe it is in their best interest to learn English. Meanwhile, it might not hurt for me to ditch some foolish pride and pick up a little Spanish.

Knowledge is what? My people are destroyed for lack of what?

Like it or not the more equipped we are to negotiate the real world obstacles ahead of us, the better our chances of survival and success.

Whether that be learning languages or following principles of a higher power, even if it doesn't make sense, perhaps especially when it doesn't make sense. Maybe that's the logical answer to a seemingly illogical situation.

One that has been given a deaf ear to by too many in this hour.

Does this mean I believe that the issue is beyond criticism? No, constructive criticism in open forums and the arena of ideals is always welcome. It is a problem, we must be patient for solutions. In the meantime, we must adapt and overcome what is coming at us in society and in the industry whether it speaks Spanish or not. You either find a way to swim or get washed away.

I'm sticking around, I love trees more than the huggers. I'll teach that and more in any language.

Feliz Navidad!

It is a dynamic thread!! why not in spanish you say? why in spanish is the thread topic, Yes, not to be cruel but your love for a fellow co-worker is admirable in the human sense!! but not in the real world sense pertaining to jobs, finances, education, pensions, healthcare, insurances, taxes, & just fair labor practices!!!!!

We need communication!! why? I communicate fine as do others & there is no need to learn a different language, those of you who find this "the new best thing" or think its an advance in future relations..SCARE ME how soon you forget most are here illegally & with all the legal methods of entry into this country why cater to em? they are given more opportunity than any of us & are given it through a manner of amnesty & pity!! many of you are the same who would bash me or any one else for crying or whining & would say its up to the individual, why so different a view in this case?

our forefathers came here to avoid tyranny, taxes & to set up a new land with freedom in thought & many more reasons.... you think they werent looked at differently by the native american`s, some helped our forefathers & look at what it got them!!!! wait till you have a plot on a reservation designated American!!

I beleive wholeheartedly in GOD!! & wish that everyone could prosper but at what expense? I think those that defend this problem have the greedy intent you speak of, they dont pay em the same to me its a type of labor slavery, while my view may seem harsh it is for the better of all!!

like I said manufacturing firms are moving south by the droves, plenty of jobs to be had, so if spanish needs to be spoken it should be for the purpose of doing LEGAL business!!! not for the purposes you speak of!! Im not against a good thing, I just see no good coming from what is at hand & getting worse!!

the next revolution will be from within & wont be pretty!! we need to become a self sufficient country once again, then we will be the super power that many think we are now & above all keep the creator in mind!!!

merry x-mas

LXT..............
 
It is a dynamic thread!! why not in Spanish you say? why in Spanish is the thread topic, Yes, not to be cruel but your love for a fellow co-worker is admirable in the human sense!! but not in the real world sense pertaining to jobs, finances, education, pensions, healthcare, insurances, taxes, & just fair labor practices!!!!!

My response to the premise of 'Why in Spanish?' is:

Why Not? We need the communication.

I'm not attempting to threaten the topic's sovereignty.

How do you detach the human sense from the real world sense?

I for one believe if we as a human race apply sound principles in the human sense, the real world, as you say, would be a much better place and these issues might see sound solutions quicker if they would become issues in the first place.

Furthermore, it's not as if these real world issues that you've given were in great shape before this influx put its burden upon them anyway. There is no question that there is a burden, and some of it is obviously unfair, but that isn't going to infect how I treat Spanish speaking people. Nor will it blur my vision about why things, even in our industry, are available in Spanish.

I gave the account of my limited experience with Sergio as a real life example about a point of contact I have with the situation that clarifies a real world need to educate and communicate industry related topics as a priority above their English as a second language needs.

Not to pull on heart strings, though there be a human element to the account. I will not separate the two, because it is that human element that illustrates perfectly the need for communication here.

We need communication!! why? I communicate fine as do others & there is no need to learn a different language, those of you who find this "the new best thing" or think its an advance in future relations..SCARE ME how soon you forget most are here illegally & with all the legal methods of entry into this country why cater to em? they are given more opportunity than any of us & are given it through a manner of amnesty & pity!! many of you are the same who would bash me or any one else for crying or whining & would say its up to the individual, why so different a view in this case?

You just said it yourself and answered your own question perfectly. "...there is no need to learn a second language..."

Like it or not, the Spanish speaking people are here and communicating things of importance are paramount to waiting for them to acquire English as a second language.

I believe it is to their benefit to learn English, just as I believe it's to my advantage to learn Spanish. It's optional, but the reality(real world) is that I'm going to be around them, and often times in charge of them, I'd like to know what they are saying and direct them safely.

I worked a retail leather store in college here in Champaign, IL. home to the University of Illinois. You talk about a multicultural melting pot! I would be dealing with customers that spoke about everything and speak English to me only when necessary. I felt that it was rude, but I lived with it was a part of the reality of the situation.

You see my friend, sometimes we need to deal productively with a situation regardless of how we feel about it. That is another answer to "Why Spanish?"

Anyway, This Spanish speaking couple comes in one night and pulls this usual stunt on me. I am fair enough with my Spanish to pick up that one asked the other if he knew how long the sale would last.

I answered before he could in English and smiled. Mind you friend, it was a bluff, but it worked. They spoke English the rest of the sale. Why? Because they had no way to know just how good my Spanish was for one, and second the only advantage had seemingly vanished. Perhaps they honored me with English the rest of the way out of embarrassment for their rudeness, or because I knew Spanish as an American and being in America they felt it more appropriate to speak the English language. Who knows really. I finished the sale, after they thanked me in English, with a little Spanish in parting. It was fun, but I learned an important lesson. One that I will apply in this industry and beyond. You are at a clear advantage to understand and speak Spanish. If for no other reason than to understand what they are saying while they figure you for an English speaking gringo. I find the same advantage around some of the German speaking Anabaptists as I have enough German from college to be dangerous as well.

Overall, my point is one of communication and the importance of it. You surely understand the need for communication in this industry, I'm just taking it one step further and seeing the need in a multilingual sense, regardless of these other issues and how we feel about them.

Furthermore, I'm not bashing you, nor do I support illegal immigration or any of its tenants. I suppose you misunderstood me when I mentioned that I see points on both sides. I meant the general arguement with respect to solutions in tandum with the general arguement concerning the impacts and effects on the workforce along with other areas of concern with regards to legals and illegals alike. It's clearly a problem, but the supposed topic of this tread is "Why Spanish?" If you or others choose to use it as a springboard to voice frustrations concerning other semi related topics then who has gone off topic?

our forefathers came here to avoid tyranny, taxes & to set up a new land with freedom in thought & many more reasons.... you think they werent looked at differently by the native american`s, some helped our forefathers & look at what it got them!!!! wait till you have a plot on a reservation designated American!!

Really we are comparing apples and oranges to a great extent here. My comments to this are simply reactive to others just to point out that our forefather’s invasion and subsequent immigration wasn't entirely without reproach. That doesn't grant a bye for those that are invading from the south, just puts things in perspective as it removes any illusions of purity to reveal the truth of our history. One we ought to keep in mind when we consider the Mexican plight in its entirety. It doesn't make them right, but it helps us to understand, and helps us to remove judgment from a position that we do not truthfully have. I should think that this would assist in helping us come to fair solutions while treating them properly in the meanwhile.

I don't agree with all that is being done and not being done, but I stress that this is besides the premise of this thread.

Besides, we shouldn't punish those that speak Spanish that are here legally for the ones that aren't here legally, even if they hold a majority. Thus 'Why Spanish?' gets another credible answer.

I believe wholeheartedly in GOD!! & wish that everyone could prosper but at what expense? I think those that defend this problem have the greedy intent you speak of, they dont pay em the same to me its a type of labor slavery, while my view may seem harsh it is for the better of all!!

I'm glad to hear of your faith, but faith without works is dead. We need to exercise the tenets of our faith no matter the time, nor place, nor political climate.

If an illegal came to me with a need, I stress need, and it was in my power to give it I would. If I could communicate(see the need) then I would stress their need to be here legally. I'd help them in that endeavor if I could. I'd help them get home if I felt a phone call would do any good. Howbeit if the government fails to uphold its own laws and create a quagmire, I will help my fellow man in the midst of it.

There is greed in those that support the breakings of the law, greed in those that lend a blind eye from a position of political power, and honestly there is a greed found often among the illegals. They have foolishly lent themselves to a type of slavery, but to them it is beneficial. They do threaten the very system that affords them this obscure opportunity.

I have the solution in one somewhat overlooked Achilles tendon. Housing. Take away their ability to live in overloaded housing situations and their ability to undercut and work for peanuts is no longer of any advantage and the realities of expense appear seemingly out of nowhere. Then the new opportunities in their homeland don't look so bad.

I feel some of your frustrations, but meanwhile in the midst of the reality of the situation, I feel a higher calling to treat Spanish speaking people as I should and see a need to communicate one way or another. That is my answer to the original premise.
 
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like I said manufacturing firms are moving south by the droves, plenty of jobs to be had, so if Spanish needs to be spoken it should be for the purpose of doing LEGAL business!!! not for the purposes you speak of!! Im not against a good thing, I just see no good coming from what is at hand & getting worse!!

I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say here. I'm not in support of illegal activity, but I'm confident that this misunderstanding has been remedied. Let us try and separate the issues briefly for the record.

Spanish does not equal illegal.

There is a need to communicate with the Spanish, illegals may benefit, but that doesn't take away from legitimate needs otherwise, nor should it effect it.

Illegals are breaking the law and causing troubles, but they are still God's creation and deserve treatment accordingly despite how we feel about the overall matter.

For that matter, many US Citizens break laws and deserve fair treatment in spite of their mistakes as well.

Let us not separate the human element from the real world..this is the human condition..we are in it together, on a planet, somewhere in the middle of a very large creation called the universe...let's try and get along.

the next revolution will be from within & wont be pretty!! we need to become a self sufficient country once again, then we will be the super power that many think we are now & above all keep the creator in mind!!!

You might be right, but you might find the illegal immigration to be the least of this country's worries, all things considered. Who knows, you might also find America needing all the help it can get. Don't be so quick to get rid of someone that might be of service if someone else wants to play super power and spies an opportunity.

You think Spanish is hard to learn!

Most of all, if we truly keep the Creator in mind then who's king and what is country is put into perspective. Then simple language barriers seem elementary and relative.


merry x-mas

LXT..............

Merry Christmas to you sir...I often enjoy your posts. God Bless, Ryan.
 
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Thank you sir...Merry Christmas.

Amen I say to you!

Love thy neighbor...do unto others...speak not so you offend

If everyone who claimed to follow Christ struggled to live their life so, then we would have a much better world.

Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses!

What a concept!

My paternal ancestors came over here in the early 1600's as convicts and religious discentors, how do they compare to the a modern day immigrant? Some probably turned into the Scots-Irish people who pushed the Amerind people back. Any comparison is hyperbole, or inaccurate historical commentary, the Irish and Swede that later mingled in were ridiculed by those whos parents came here before, just as some of us do now. "no blacks or Irish welcome!"

Milwaukee was a predominantly Germanic speaking community prior to WWI, then they started beating kids in school who spoke it.

I'll hold to my belief that it is very difficult to find labor worth their salt from the current crop of young people. You really have to winnow the chaff, even at 12-15 an hour to start.If they are Indian, Hmong, Hispanic or whatever, if they are legal, I will do whatever needs be done to get the job done well and safe.
 
Love the post Bigus.

Hope you and everyone is having a great Christmas and all the best for the New Year.


"Man fears what he does not know, and what he fears, he despises"

I can't remember who said it, but it is a quote that I've remembered for a long time.
 
I am sick of people saying the spanish only speaking people are here, like it or not. The illegals are here, like it or not. Well no, it's not "like it or not" We don't have to accept it at all and it's high time we all realized that. We need to either wake up or just go ahead and declare spanish and english both co-official languages of the U.S. and get it over with.
 
Well no, it's not "like it or not" We don't have to accept it at all and it's high time we all realized that.

Many of these people have been here as productive residents with tacit approval of the US government by using the Individual Tax Number system. Wink & Nod pay your taxes and nothing will be said. They've been here for 10-20 years, maybe more. Their kids know nothing but the USA, and may have been born here (making them citizens...)

I'm all for making sure the criminals do not get through.

I think they should make it easier for legal migrants to come in.

I'm for a program for those people who have been paying taxes to get naturalized. Call it amnesty if you want, if we want to change the rules, or narrow them down in this case, then we should grandfather those who have been good the entire time they have been here.

Do not villify the worker, they just want a better life.

Boycott those companies that perpetuate the system, or do you want the cheap prices, but not work for the cheap wages?
 
I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say here. I'm not in support of illegal activity, but I'm confident that this misunderstanding has been remedied. Let us try and separate the issues briefly for the record.

Spanish does not equal illegal.

There is a need to communicate with the Spanish, illegals may benefit, but that doesn't take away from legitimate needs otherwise, nor should it effect it.

Illegals are breaking the law and causing troubles, but they are still God's creation and deserve treatment accordingly despite how we feel about the overall matter.

For that matter, many US Citizens break laws and deserve fair treatment in spite of their mistakes as well.

Let us not separate the human element from the real world..this is the human condition..we are in it together, on a planet, somewhere in the middle of a very large creation called the universe...let's try and get along.



You might be right, but you might find the illegal immigration to be the least of this country's worries, all things considered. Who knows, you might also find America needing all the help it can get. Don't be so quick to get rid of someone that might be of service if someone else wants to play super power and spies an opportunity.

You think Spanish is hard to learn!

Most of all, if we truly keep the Creator in mind then who's king and what is country is put into perspective. Then simple language barriers seem elementary and relative.




Merry Christmas to you sir...I often enjoy your posts. God Bless, Ryan.


Ryan, what I was trying to point out is job opportunities are becoming more available south of the border & elsewhere for that matter, I just dont understand the claims of "americans dont want these jobs", they work harder for less pay, they this they that!!! this is the spin being broadcast to us!! I dont think spanish is hard to learn if I wanted to learn it in the first place.

I harbor no prejudice toward the latino/hispanic people, I just dont think their language should be imposed on us, how many of us learned the Native American language? you`re right Spanish doesnt = Illegal.

You speak of Rude in your post, the reason Americans are angry is because of just such, how ignorant is it to break the law, work a job for much less than what an american would, put the burden of leagality on americans shoulders, put safety, language, taxes, healthcare, pensions, transportation, education, etc... on Americans shoulders & do it knowingly!!!!

So not only do we foot the bill for them but we loose jobs to them & all at our expense, they know what they are doing is wrong but continue to do it any way......this is not only rude but an ignorant slap in the face as well.

I follow the word of God best I can, am a sinner, thank Christ often!!! do I backslide on occasion? Yes! but all in all I try my best to follow God`s law first & mans law second, I just wonder what Law it is that they we speak of follow? Cause as I see it they follow the God named money!! Break the laws of man & the love thy neighbor....do unto others.....speak not to offend seems one sided to me in this situation.

I dont think it is rude of us (Americans) to send Illegal immigrants back home, I dont think it is rude of us to ask them when in America to follow our laws, speak our language, support youself at your expense, etc..etc.. Do this & do it legally.........well then.......Welcome to America!


LXT..........
 
Many of these people have been here as productive residents with tacit approval of the US government by using the Individual Tax Number system. Wink & Nod pay your taxes and nothing will be said. They've been here for 10-20 years, maybe more. Their kids know nothing but the USA, and may have been born here (making them citizens...)

I'm all for making sure the criminals do not get through.

I think they should make it easier for legal migrants to come in.

I'm for a program for those people who have been paying taxes to get naturalized. Call it amnesty if you want, if we want to change the rules, or narrow them down in this case, then we should grandfather those who have been good the entire time they have been here.

Do not villify the worker, they just want a better life.

Boycott those companies that perpetuate the system, or do you want the cheap prices, but not work for the cheap wages?

You are right about the individual tax number system, some illegals do pay taxes based on an assigned number and I guess if some sort of amnesty program were to be put into place they should be the ones to benefit from it. But the thing about it is recent studies have shown that out of 13 million illegals here now only about 160,000 have ever, that's EVER at any time, paid any social security or income taxes. That looks like this:13,000,000 vs. 160,000. I guess the other 12,840,000 can go home.
 

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