Your thouhts on fuel please

[cajunhillbilly]

(maybe the alcohol is still in there, but they just do not charge you for it . . .)

I and probably most wonder this. The unleaded no-E gas I buy does smell and look a little different from the other. For sure runs better. My local Co-op won't take that chance for a few extra dollars.

 

[user 64030]

All I know for sure is that at my local gas station I can put more than 6 gallons of fuel in my 5 gallon plastic can. Do you think they are screwing me? I quit buying gas there anyway...

Could be couple of things....

1) the can you have holds more than 5 gl. Does it have graduated fill marks? 1 gl, 2gl, 3gl, etc Does it have space above the 5 gl mark? I have a 5 gl can that holds nearly 6 if filled to the brim.
2) The can could be of poor quality and the mentiond fill marks are wrong and what it says is 5 is actually 6.
3) the stations pump is out of calibration.

You can take a known good volume an to the station and fill it, and see what it measures. Maybe fill the same can at a different station etc. If you feel the pump is inaccuratly measuring fuel talk w/ the manger about having the pump repaired or call the your state attorney's office.

dw

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Could be couple of things....

1) the can you have holds more than 5 gl. Does it have graduated fill marks? 1 gl, 2gl, 3gl, etc Does it have space above the 5 gl mark? I have a 5 gl can that holds nearly 6 if filled to the brim.
2) The can could be of poor quality and the mentiond fill marks are wrong and what it says is 5 is actually 6.
3) the stations pump is out of calibration.

You can take a known good volume an to the station and fill it, and see what it measures. Maybe fill the same can at a different station etc. If you feel the pump is inaccuratly measuring fuel talk w/ the manger about having the pump repaired or call the your state attorney's office.

dw

The thing is, when I go fill up my gas cans I never fill them to the top because they'd just spill out some on the way home. It says 5 gallon on the side, never saw a mark to fill to. I'm thinking the pump needs calibrated or someone's done it deliberately. I don't know enough about gas pumps but I imagine there's a screw somewhere to turn to do your own "calibrating".

 

[Philbert]

FAQ on the STIHL website:

Will a 10% (E10) blend of ethanol hurt my gas-powered STIHL product?

All STIHL gasoline powered engines can be used with up to a 10% (E10) blend of ethanol in the gasoline/engine oil mix. We also recommend that if a unit will be left unused for more than 30 days that it be stored "dry." This means emptying the fuel tank and then restarting and letting the unit run until all the fuel is consumed and the engine stops. For maximum performance and engine life expectancy we also recommend using STIHL Ultra 2-cycle engine oil with built in stabilizer.

(Note that they do not encourage consumption of ethanol while operating their products . . . . that's in the operator's manuals)

Philbert

 

[user 64030]

FAQ on the STIHL website:



(Note that they do not encourage consumption of ethanol while operating their products . . . . that's in the operator's manuals)

Philbert

Dang-nab-it

dw

 

[WadePatton]

i get the highest octane from the local store, used to run 40:1 now run 32:1. if it gets 6 weeks old, it becomes weed killer, fire starter, parts cleaner, etc-anything buy fuel for my 2 strokes.

neighbor buys the 87 octane...and cusses and fussed about EEFANol gas all day long.

I suspect that the high-grade has less corn turd in it. dino turd is preferred.

ALSO, i now always pour my fuel into a clear container to see what's at the bottom before fueling.

YES, fuel _can_ be hygroscopic. http://www.fuel-testers.com/marine_boat_ethanol_problems.html

or let's say you do this: pour a teaspoon of water into "pure" gasoline, then pour a teaspoon of water into moonshine or whatever corn-likker you have handy...see the diff? one beaded and went to the bottom. the other mixed right in.

any vented system is exposed to atmosphere. atmosphere usually contains water.

 

[Jakers]

This is the only true way short of chemical break down to test for ethanol in gas. you dont need the test tube but you do need a bottle with a line on it like a pop bottle. better to use something approved for gas but any clear bottle will work and the smaller the better. mark a line about 1/8 of the total volume from the bottom. fill with water to that line. fill with gas to be tested the rest of the way leaving only a small space if any. shake for one minute then let sit for a few minutes and look what happens. if theres E in the gas it will mix with the water and your water line will be higher than your line on the container. if no E was in the gas your water line should be the same as your line on the bottle. this happens because you have reached the saturation point of the amount of water the ethanol can "absorb" and still mix with the gas so it settles out with the water. Now anybody thats ever shaken a gas can knows about the expansion and gas vapor pressure that builds up so thats why you want a small container with little to no air gap in it. open carefully and discard appropriately... Hope this helps out and BE CAREFUL!!!!!!

Philbert

 

[firewood guy]

Just my .02

If you can find non ethanol gas, buy the highest octane level, use a quality stabilizer like Sta-Bil, and I like the Stihl HP Ultra (which has a little stabilizer in it), and mix it at 45:1-50:1. This blend will stay viable for over a year in my area , and I don't believe in draining fuel out of equipment for storage. Reason being is that the carb and other fuel system components seem to have many more issues when drained than if we keep them wet with a good, stabilized fuel mix. My "proof" to this theory is that we have some 10-12 year-old saws that have never needed a carb overhaul or even a fuel line! Just stay away from any fuel with corn whiskey in it!!

 

[Aussie Dave]

I don't believe in draining fuel out of equipment for storage. Reason being is that the carb and other fuel system components seem to have many more issues when drained than if we keep them wet with a good, stabilized fuel mix. My "proof" to this theory is that we have some 10-12 year-old saws that have never needed a carb overhaul or even a fuel line! Just stay away from any fuel with corn whiskey in it!![/QUOTE]

Exactly what i have found to,i only drain and refresh when im about to use it.never had a problem,but then fuel isnt what it used to be and i dont use ethonol.
Different thing i know but old car carbies hated being left dry.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I don't believe in draining fuel out of equipment for storage. Reason being is that the carb and other fuel system components seem to have many more issues when drained than if we keep them wet with a good, stabilized fuel mix. My "proof" to this theory is that we have some 10-12 year-old saws that have never needed a carb overhaul or even a fuel line! Just stay away from any fuel with corn whiskey in it!!

Exactly what i have found to,i only drain and refresh when im about to use it.never had a problem,but then fuel isnt what it used to be and i dont use ethonol.
Different thing i know but old car carbies hated being left dry.[/QUOTE]

Up until recently non ethanol fuel wasn't available in my area unless you went to the race track and paid a big price for it. I prefer to leave mine either dry or with a good amount of that Sea Foam in the fuel. If you leave them for long with ethanol in them it will do a number on the fuel line you buy nowadays. It seems the original equipment fuel lines in some of the old saws was made of some pretty good stuff, I wonder if you can buy a roll of that black fuel line...

 

[badwood]

All I run in my saw is airplane fuel it has the highest octane I can find and no ethanol. it is only 1.50 more a gallon then 93. The reason I have started using it is i had blown up my saw a year ago and the Guy that did the work said he has had more blown up saws in the last two years then he has had in Many years and it is all do to the ethanol he said the ettohanol breaks down the oil in the mix so that the saw runs hot and blows the saw up. so that is way I switch

 

[Philbert]

My "proof" to this theory is that we have some 10-12 year-old saws that have never needed a carb overhaul or even a fuel line!

Carbs from 10-12 years ago were less fussy than current carbs.

It's different if you are running them on a regular basis, versus letting them sit for months at a time.

I posted STIHL's recommendations in post #44.

Philbert

 

[saw dog]

The whole point of me doing the test was to see if the gas would "draw" the moisture out of the air. It didn't. Pouring water in the gas wouldn't confirm it. I think the problem is all of the other chemicals and additives that are in the gas. Back when we had leaded gas, none of these problems existed. Regular leaded gas is now called race gas. When we are forced to use the E15, the problems will get worse.

If I am not mistaken, running the experment as you did would not have showen whether there was moisture in the gas or not since the gas with 10% ethinol asorbes the moisture and in turn evaporated with the gas. If you had added oil you would have seen that the oil did not mix with the gas due to the asorbed water or if it did mix with the gas you would see a seperation with in a few days. Redoo your experment in this way and see what happens, I am going to try it myself just to see if this is correct. It is good to see you are interested enough to try and find awnsers to this problem.

 

[Bret4207]

The thing is, when I go fill up my gas cans I never fill them to the top because they'd just spill out some on the way home. It says 5 gallon on the side, never saw a mark to fill to. I'm thinking the pump needs calibrated or someone's done it deliberately. I don't know enough about gas pumps but I imagine there's a screw somewhere to turn to do your own "calibrating".

I'm not sure how things are run in Indiana, but here every commercial pump has to be certified for accuracy annually. That's every single mom and pop corner store in the boonies as well as the 7-11 and the big super stations.

My Google-fu is working, I just found this story from an Indianapolis TV station that states every pump in Indiana is supposed to be certified annually- but you guys have some problems! Read all about it- 13 Investigates finds more pump problems - 13 WTHR

 

[RimRox]

93 octane mixed with AMSOIL 100:1 Synthetic-NO ISSUES EVER

 

[WadePatton]

It's a 2-stroke engine.

x amount of gasoline can produce y amount of energy

in a 2-stroke engine

at a given cylinder pressure with gasoline as the base fuel.

turbochargers, superchargers, oxygen-bearing fuels/enhancements TAKE A HIKE.

this is about gasoline from the corner-store pump and the cheapest 2-stroke mixing oil available:

Hence and HERETOFORE:

The amount of power that can be developed is determined by the amount of fuel that can be burned at a given cylinder pressure which is determined by displacement and compression ratios and the final clearances determined by the composite tolerances used by the engine mfg'ing industry-which can be improved upon by the careful mechanic.

This amount of fuel and subsequent POWER (to do work) cannot be changed by any miraculous meddling with the atomization already provided by the carburetor, nor can it be tweaked by jamming up the arse of the machine with catalytic devices-

CATALISM would be wonderful in the combustion chamber from which ICE's (internal combustion engines) draw 100% of their power. Unfortunately this is not where it is employed.

Simply a smokestack scrubber.

Given that amount of power, controlled as you see by displacement/compression mostly-as you see you can only burn _so much_ fuel in the prescence of _so much_ oxygen. that's just how oxidation works. the chemicals MUST react at a proscribed rate. More fuel must have more oxygen to make any difference.

Leaner is meaner, but just exactly how quickly do you want to burn it up?

i don't ####(richard) around anymore. 4 ounces mix to 128 oz of gas. period. how i roll.

_the new "cleaner" diesel requires more gallons to get the job done...cleaner?--no, not really_

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

If I am not mistaken, running the experment as you did would not have showen whether there was moisture in the gas or not since the gas with 10% ethinol asorbes the moisture and in turn evaporated with the gas. If you had added oil you would have seen that the oil did not mix with the gas due to the asorbed water or if it did mix with the gas you would see a seperation with in a few days. Redoo your experment in this way and see what happens, I am going to try it myself just to see if this is correct. It is good to see you are interested enough to try and find awnsers to this problem.

Read post # 13. I think that the only way fuel with ethanol can draw any appreciable amount of water from the air is if you were in a teopical rain forrest. This is MY thoughts, not scientific proof. We live in MS where the humidity stays from 85% and up in the summer.
I would think that one of my tests wouls have shown something, but it didn't. Now, this was with 10% ethanol. With what little I know of chemistry and physics, the 85% ethanol would have potential to attract more water.
I'd like others to do some test and see what results they get. Gas is almost too expensive, though!