Crappy Stihl Cylinder - Looks like ChiCom Garbage!!!

[Erick]

I keep reading "did it cause a problem" you tell me???

What is one of the main goals when porting a saw for more performance???

To clean up the casting flaws and smooth out the ports...... those ports look pretty damn ruff to me with a whole lot of casting flaws so to ask "did it cause a problem" I say YES!! There is no way you can tell me that casting like that is not going to have a negative impact on product performance. What the real question is will the guy who just spent $550.00 on that saw know the difference... I say probably not..... does that make it OK????


Did Black Cats tranny cause him any problems.... no

Did it fail on him..... YES!!

 

[bookerdog]

Dolmar 7900w for sale


Hehe, crapolla I have been fussing about this for a year or so, but Brad got the pics to prove.
BTW, if not familiar with close up photography -those were great shots. Job Brad.

Dumpmar whats that

 

[blsnelling]

Clearly the only answer to all of this is armed revolution in the streets...

LOL. Ain't life grand

 

[BlackCatBone]

Dolmar 7900w for sale


Hehe, crapolla I have been fussing about this for a year or so, but Brad got the pics to prove.
BTW, if not familiar with close up photography -those were great shots. Job Brad.

Hilarious. Giant font was a nice touch.

 

[PatrickIreland]

Please tell me the percentage of Stihl customers that know how to judge quality at this level.

As I asked, please read the thread, the part has two or more tanks of gas on it, not to mention the tuning run at VB...

I would guess a very tiny percentage would judge the quality at this level. But this cylinder has had two tanks of gas through it, and is already looking beaten up? Stihl's main market is never going to be the chainsaw enthusiasts, same as Ford's main market is never going to be car/truck enthusiasts.
What I am saying is, Stihl is not supposed to be the "Ford" or "Chevy" of the market, they are meant to, and were, the (Pick the more expensive car of your choice) of the market.
This car/chainsaw manufacturer, has sold a cheaply made, engine/cylinder, which will ruin their reputation if they keep doing it?

 

[Erick]

I would guess a very tiny percentage would judge the quality at this level. But this cylinder has had two tanks of gas through it, and is already looking beaten up? Stihl's main market is never going to be the chainsaw enthusiasts, same as Ford's main market is never going to be car/truck enthusiasts.
What I am saying is, Stihl is not supposed to be the "Ford" or "Chevy" of the market, they are meant to, and were, the (Pick the more expensive car of your choice) of the market.
This car/chainsaw manufacturer, has sold a cheaply made, engine/cylinder, which will ruin their reputation if they keep doing it?

Well put. (still can't rep ya )

 

[Tzed250]

I would guess a very tiny percentage would judge the quality at this level. But this cylinder has had two tanks of gas through it, and is already looking beaten up? Stihl's main market is never going to be the chainsaw enthusiasts, same as Ford's main market is never going to be car/truck enthusiasts.
What I am saying is, Stihl is not supposed to be the "Ford" or "Chevy" of the market, they are meant to, and were, the (Pick the more expensive car of your choice) of the market.
This car/chainsaw manufacturer, has sold a cheaply made, engine/cylinder, which will ruin their reputation if they keep doing it?

I agree 100%

The cylinder is not perfect, and it is not an example of how to do it "the best they know how".

I believe that Stihl sees the end of what started as the 024 in the near future. The cylinder is the minimum that will get the job done.

The MS441 is Stihl's Flagship saw. I would like to see a close exam of a current 441 top-end, as I believe it would be more inicative of the top level at Stihl.

Stihl's reputation will only be ruined if the parts fail in service, and nothing has been proven to that effect.

 

[blsnelling]

Brad hailed the 361BB cylinder (true Chicom junk with cylindricity issues), and trashes the Stihl cylinder that has no proven functional defects.

I pointed out the defects in the BB kit just like I did this one. I don't care what the brand is or who's selling it.

 

[Tzed250]

I keep reading "did it cause a problem" you tell me???

What is one of the main goals when porting a saw for more performance???

To clean up the casting flaws and smooth out the ports...... those ports look pretty damn ruff to me with a whole lot of casting flaws so to ask "did it cause a problem" I say YES!! There is no way you can tell me that casting like that is not going to have a negative impact on product performance. What the real question is will the guy who just spent $550.00 on that saw know the difference... I say probably not..... does that make it OK????


Did Black Cats tranny cause him any problems.... no

Did it fail on him..... YES!!

If the saw makes the target HP then the casting marks have been allowed in the engineering and are part of the system.

 

[bookerdog]

The MS441 is Stihl's Flagship saw. I would like to see a close exam of a current 441 top-end, as I believe it would be more inicative of the top level at Stihl.
QUOTE]
screwed up the quote so made it bold.

I hope to get that done in a week or so.

 

[Tzed250]

I pointed out the defects in the BB kit just like I did this one. I don't care what the brand is or who's selling it.

But you did not start a thread with an inflammatory title, and the makers name, denouncing the quality. Quite the opposite in fact...

Maybe because it was part of your "hook up"...

 

[FATGUY]

If the saw makes the target HP then the casting marks have been allowed in the engineering and are part of the system.

That's exactlywhat I'm afraid of. I'd be a lot more comfortable thinking one slipped by QA than thinking Stihl now considered this acceptable. The fault is in the casting, a machinist can only machine what's there.

 

[Tzed250]

That's exactlywhat I'm afraid of. I'd be a lot more comfortable thinking one slipped by QA than thinking Stihl now considered this acceptable. The fault is in the casting, a machinist can only machine what's there.

If the saw makes the target HP, where is the flaw in the casting?

 

[blsnelling]

Some folks will never hear it Brad.... Kudos to you for calling them out.

This is not a one time defective cylinder it is (as someone has already pointed out) the product of a shift in manufacturing and a trend toward cheaper quality as a result.

I have seen to many to think it's a one time fluke.... you can either choose to see it or turn a blind eye... makes me no nevermind.

Brad is (as labeled by this board) a STIHLHEAD.... I'm sure it was a hard lump to swallow for Brad to make this post as it was for Brian... as it was for me but... it is what it is and it can't anything other than that it is what it is..... I personally am a Stihlhaed at heart also but I got that way by a continued succession of top quality products, my allegiance was earned not given and I will call them like I see them and if this is what I can expect from Stihl in the future..... I will look elsewhere.

I buy my OPE for QUALITY period... I don't care what it costs or who makes it, if Stihl wants to keep my business they are going to have to do better than this. If I wanted to buy junk I'd get me a Wildthing and save some money.

Wow Erick. Wish I could put it like that. You hit the nail on the head...several times.

We've settle the question and this is not a one time defect but can be expected when buying a new Pro Stihl saw. This is not isolated to the "outdated" 260, but includes the almighty 660 and 460 as well. This is not the quality with which Stihl earned their reputation, neither with the world or myself. They have taught us to expect high quality and demand the price for it. They have dropped their end of the deal.

So you want to know if it hurts performance. I don't care! That does not matter at this point! The end does not justify the means. So do you practice situational ethics as well? What are the defects? I named them all in the first post. Go re-read it. Just because it runs doesn't make it ok. The quality of this cylinder SUCKS!! Period. You cannot deny that. Don't just tell me it still runs.

Let's put this another way. Suppose I bring you in a MS260 with a bad P&C. You order a new OEM P&C for me and this is the one you get. Are you going to put it on my saw? Or are you going to do what I did and raise the flag? Or are you going to enable manufactures to continue the downhill trend to put crap quality like this in their product? My philosophy is, "Do it right, or don't do it at all".

 

[FATGUY]

If the saw makes the target HP, where is the flaw in the casting?

you did see the pics right? There was a shift in the casting process. Walls are thinner in some places, thicker in others. The unit is notfunctioning as it was designed While it may not immediately show signs of reduced power, longevity WILL be affected

 

[Tzed250]

Wow Erick. Wish I could put it like that. You hit the nail on the head...several times.

We've settle the question and this is not a one time defect but can be expected when buying a new Pro Stihl saw. This is not isolated to the "outdated" 260, but includes the almighty 660 and 460 as well. This is not the quality with which Stihl earned their reputation, neither with the world or myself. They have taught us to expect high quality and demand the price for it. They have dropped their end of the deal.

So you want to know if it hurts performance. I don't care! That does not matter at this point! The end does not justify the means. So do you practice situational ethics as well? What are the defects? I named them all in the first post. Go re-read it. Just because it runs doesn't make it ok. The quality of this cylinder SUCKS!! Period. You cannot deny that. Don't just tell me it still runs.

Let's put this another way. Suppose I bring you in a MS260 with a bad P&C. You order a new OEM P&C for me and this is the one you get. Are you going to put it on my saw? Or are you going to do what I did and raise the flag? Or are you going to enable manufactures to continue the downhill trend to put crap quality like this in their product? My philosophy is, "Do it right, or don't do it at all".

What are the functional defects?

How much compression did it have before it was torn down?

 

[blsnelling]

But you did not start a thread with an inflammatory title, and the makers name, denouncing the quality. Quite the opposite in fact...

Maybe because it was part of your "hook up"...

That's because the expectations are very different. One has a reputation of problems on this board. The other is touted as the be all end all of quality. And BTW, that 361BB review was the very first dealings I ever had with Baileys and expected nothing in return. That all came after the fact.

TZed, you're fighting an uphill battle against the current. Anyone in their right mind, without alterior motives, will agree.

 

[blsnelling]

How much compression did it have before it was torn down?

I don't know and don't care. That's beside the point.

Would you accept irregular tires, defective leather interior, scrapped up paint on a new Mercedes? You know, it still drives fine! Nothing wrong with that car. They're just trying to maintian profit margins. Stihl is supposed to be the best in the industry.

 

[blsnelling]

What are the functional defects?

So is function the only thing that matters? Not in my books. I would hope that anyone I pay to work on anything I own wouldn't feel that way either.

 

[Tzed250]

That's because the expectations are very different. One has a reputation of problems on this board. The other is touted as the be all end all of quality. And BTW, that 361BB review was the very first dealings I ever had with Baileys and expected nothing in return. That all came after the fact.

TZed, you're fighting an uphill battle against the current. Anyone in their right mind, without alterior motives, will agree.

I don't know and don't care. That's beside the point.

Would you accept irregular tires, defective leather interior, scrapped up paint on a new Mercedes? Stihl is supposed to be the best in the industry.

I don't follow the current, that is your MO.

Tell me Brad, what is more important, the cylindricity of a bore, or the smoothness of a port?

Why not trash the 361BB with the same zeal that you have the 260 jug?

Stihl is the best, don't fool yourself into thinking QA issues do not exist with the others.