Fun with Ethanol: Lookign for E2 in North Central MA

[DougNH]

Late this morning I started a project of trying to find the lowest ethanol-content fuel within a 5-mile radius. I used my ethanol testing kit from fuel-testers and took samples by first putting 1 gallon into my car or truck (to flush out whatever was already in the hose) and then taking a 1-gallon sample. I got the following results, including from a can of pump gas that I saved when the hurricanes hit and fuel shortages were possible:

Sunoco GTX260 Unleaded Race Fuel: 0%
Hess regular from late August: 5% (with Sta-Bil)
Mobil Unleaded Super: 5%
Saveway Unleaded Premium: 7%
Mobil Unleaded Regular: 8%
Hess Unleaded Premium: 8%
Saveway Unleaded Regular: 9%
Hess Unleaded Regular: 10%

I mixed 40% Mobil Super and 60% Sunoco GTX260 to get my max desired 2% ethanol, at an resulting octane way higher than I need.

Filled up the MS361 with this new mix and it runs like a banshee

Later this week I'll try to sample Shell, Getty and Citgo (10-mile radius).

(also contains ethanol at ~4.5%)

 

[blsnelling]

Yeah, race gas will run way rich in an engine tuned for unleaded pump gas. You can't just switch fuels like that withough retuning.

 

[kurtty]

wow you guys have a lot of ethanol in the states. im in norhtern saskatchewan and i dont think i could find ethinol if i tried.

 

[kevin j]

i dont think i could find ethinol if i tried. Q


Don't try !

It's ok in daily drivers but a PITA in small engines.

where do you get the tester kit? instrument, or consumable test strips?
For all smallengines, lawn equipmen and motorcycles, I get unleaded ethanol free from the pumps around here for collector vehicles, just wondering if it truly is E free.

kcj

 

[Haywire Haywood]

Bailey's is selling an ethanol tester... Here

Ian

 

[Bob Wright]

Lets see, where i live we have Circle K, Speedway, Gulf, Marathon, Shell, Get Go (Giant Eagle), Sheetz, Certified, and prob 10 or 15 mom and pop places and guess what....All the gas comes from the same tank at the local refinery. So if you go across the street to get different gas it doesn't matter much. Just my thought. I am the guy making the gas...Bob

 

[mtfallsmikey]

BTW doug, did you get to test any Shell?

 

[Urbicide]

Lets see, where i live we have Circle K, Speedway, Gulf, Marathon, Shell, Get Go (Giant Eagle), Sheetz, Certified, and prob 10 or 15 mom and pop places and guess what....All the gas comes from the same tank at the local refinery. So if you go across the street to get different gas it doesn't matter much. Just my thought. I am the guy making the gas...Bob

Bob, how much ethanol is being blended into the gas? Any difference between the amount in regular verses premium? Do you supply Cincinnati or know who does?

Vince

 

[Magellan]

where do you get the tester kit? instrument, or consumable test strips?

Any cylinder will work, preferably graduated. You could use a shot glass if you wanted to. You're testing for phase separation. It's a pretty simple test based on the fact that alcohol is hygroscopic.

You simply fill the cylinder with a quantity of water, say 25% of the cylinder's capacity. Add another 25% of the cylinder's capacity in gasoline. If alcohol is present, then it'll absorb water and phase separate from the gasoline (water is heavier than gas/oil). The gasoline phase will shrink while the alcohol/water phase grows. Measure the relative volume change and you have an estimate of the gasoline's alcohol content.

The phase separation test can't distinguish between methyl and ethyl alcohols. I don't know if methyl has been regulated out or not. Hopefully it's all ethyl these days, since methyl is harder on the engines.

 

[Haywire Haywood]

So... if all you had available was E-something and you wanted no ethanol, all you have to do is add some water, let it separate and then siphon off the pure gasoline, leaving the ethanol and water in the bottom.

Ian

 

[Magellan]

So... if all you had available was E-something and you wanted no ethanol, all you have to do is add some water, let it separate and then siphon off the pure gasoline, leaving the ethanol and water in the bottom.

Ian

You could do that, but it'd lower the octane rating. I don't know what all the compounds are that they use in gasoline so doing that might have other effects that I don't know how to guess at.

Certain parts of gasoline formulations and labeling are controlled by the state you live in. It might be worthwhile to look up the regulations online for those who are concerned.

 

[Haywire Haywood]

I've been running avgas for a few months now so I don't have to worry about what they're putting in the pump gas anymore.

Ian

 

[slabmaster]

I heard thay are putting it inav gas now!

 

[DougNH]

I heard thay are putting it inav gas now!

There's only one way to know for sure - test it!

 

[DougNH]

Certain parts of gasoline formulations and labeling are controlled by the state you live in. It might be worthwhile to look up the regulations online for those who are concerned.

Most of the Northeast as far North as southeastern NH requires "reformulated gasoline" (RFG) and now contains a minimum of 5.7% ethanol. The "search for E2" title of this thread was meant as a joke, since the only way to get anything below 5% here is to mix gasoline with some other fuel such as avgas or race fuel, or drive a loooong way to get different gasoline.

http://www.epa.gov/otaq/rfg/whereyoulive.htm

 

[Lakeside53]

I heard thay are putting it in avgas now!

Nope... there is some testing going on, just like NO-Lead Avgas, but not on a generally available basis.

 

[Bob Wright]

Bob, how much ethanol is being blended into the gas? Any difference between the amount in regular verses premium? Do you supply Cincinnati or know who does?

Vince

With so many pipelines running its hard to tell. We do have a refinery in Ky that may come up your way. I will have to ask my kid about the ethanol blend since he does that job. I just know its been added over the last year or so. I will get back with some answers...Bob

Note: All Marathon VOC controlled RFG is blended with 10% ethanol.
This applies to all grades.

 

[B_Turner]

I been using Chevron 91 for the last few years and it's always tested no alcohol. I noticed the 10 percent stickers last time so I just tested it again.

Bummer, around 5 or 6 percent alcohol now....(new stuff might even be 10 percent and it's just mixed with the old stuff in the tank.)

I wonder if anybody sells any non alcohol gas locally anymore. Maybe I'll test some shell...

 

[Lakeside53]

Not this winter... "we" (Puget Sound) failed the air quality standards last winter... so because of last winters' weather, we have to "suffer" the alcohol gas this year... yep... makes prefect sense to someone.

It's really not a problem if you keep the gas less than 60 days, and your saws are tuned for it (slightly richer than non blended gas).

 

[amissionaryman]

wandering why

I am curious as to why you all are concerned about ethanol blended fuel?