PM Canadien
- Thread starter lmbrman
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Well it took most of the day but I did get the 177 back together and running today. Since I don't have an oiler button I didn't install the chain yet.
First run was rather disappointing, excessively rich even with both adjust screws fully clockwise. I dreaded having to remove the carburetor after the challenges of getting it together in the first place but in fact the job went quite nicely. I had set the metering lever visually and expected I would find it too high but instead I found this. I almost overlooked it I was so focused on the metering lever...
That was a easy fix and the saw now starts and runs as it should. We spent another hour or so mending some leaks in the tank vent and primer pick up line and in the end all is well.
Does anyone have an idea where this should go? I'm pretty sure it came out of this saw but I can't for the life of me figure out where it belongs.
Crankshaft seals, reseal the crankcase, grommets and lines in the fuel and oil tanks, carburetor rebuild, manifold (insulator) gasket, change a few odd screws, and it is in pretty good shape again.
The spark arrestor screen was pretty rough so I left it out...
Mark
First run was rather disappointing, excessively rich even with both adjust screws fully clockwise. I dreaded having to remove the carburetor after the challenges of getting it together in the first place but in fact the job went quite nicely. I had set the metering lever visually and expected I would find it too high but instead I found this. I almost overlooked it I was so focused on the metering lever...
That was a easy fix and the saw now starts and runs as it should. We spent another hour or so mending some leaks in the tank vent and primer pick up line and in the end all is well.
Does anyone have an idea where this should go? I'm pretty sure it came out of this saw but I can't for the life of me figure out where it belongs.
Crankshaft seals, reseal the crankcase, grommets and lines in the fuel and oil tanks, carburetor rebuild, manifold (insulator) gasket, change a few odd screws, and it is in pretty good shape again.
The spark arrestor screen was pretty rough so I left it out...
Mark
Attachments
very cool saw Mark.
Mark, that little clip looks like a clamp for ignition wires under the flywheel.
After reviewing the IPL for the nth time, I believe you are correct Chris, looks like Item #50. I guess I'll have to go back into that saw one more time to make it right.
Mark
Mark
Just as you said Chris, thank you very much.
Mark
Problem solved.
I'm starting to accept the bitter reality that my PM 270 may need crank seals... I can't seem to get a tune at WOT. For the first 3 - 4 seconds at WOT it has a good little 4-stroke blurble, but then the blurble goes away, RPMs pick up a little and it seems like it's slightly lean (no audible 4-stroking) after 5 - 6 seconds. It's also a little slow to return to idle. Not like a bad leak, but like a seal starting to go... I think....
A few questions for someone like CBFarmall that knows these saws intimately...
- Does anyone have part numbers for bearings and seals?
- just how bad is replacing seals? Splitting the case? Should I expect to need new gaskets?
My old Canadien may be one step closer to a wall hanger, I rebuilt the carb and can't seem to get a consistent tune on the top end. But it idles like a dream, I'm just out of options it seems.
A few questions for someone like CBFarmall that knows these saws intimately...
- Does anyone have part numbers for bearings and seals?
- just how bad is replacing seals? Splitting the case? Should I expect to need new gaskets?
My old Canadien may be one step closer to a wall hanger, I rebuilt the carb and can't seem to get a consistent tune on the top end. But it idles like a dream, I'm just out of options it seems.
I'll get the seal numbers, they're common. Main bearings are 6203c3 on both sides. I would recommend changing them because PM and IEL both used shielded bearings. Most of the time, after 60 some years, these bearings are rough turning or seizing up. Changing them requires pulling the cylinder, piston and rod, pulling the ignition and flywheel case off and knocking the crank out. Use heat when installing the bearings. The flywheel side has a lip over the seal meaning you have to install the seal before the before the bearing and the case half must always be pulled to change the seal. When you do this you'll know how rough the bearings are.
Expect to make gaskets. They are not out there. Be very careful with the fiber head gasket. Recoat with copper sealant.
That said, you it idles like a dream? Bad seals generally reveal themselves here first. I'd be looking at the fuel lines or diaphragm lever height first. Otherwise, start tearing it apart.
Expect to make gaskets. They are not out there. Be very careful with the fiber head gasket. Recoat with copper sealant.
That said, you it idles like a dream? Bad seals generally reveal themselves here first. I'd be looking at the fuel lines or diaphragm lever height first. Otherwise, start tearing it apart.
Seals CR6541, both sides.
What's up with that plug wire?
Red electrical tape where it was rubbing on the housing a little.
Does that saw have an auto oiler? It is impulse driven. If the diaphragm is torn, could be your problem?
I'm pretty good at tuning saws but this has me stumped.... yeah it starts great and will sit and idle perfectly, great throttle response and power in a cut. But when I try WOT out of the cut, I get a few seconds of 4-stroking and then it smooths out and revs slightly. If I go much richer it starts to get lazy and smokey off idle.
I just replaced all the diaphragms, the metering lever was about dead level with the carb body.
Low speed screw is 1/2 turn and hi speed is a full turn. Everything seems very good except the WOT test just seems to drift slightly... and I'm too scared to risk melting the piston.
The old girl is manual oiler only, it's a very early 270.
I could try very gradually going a little more rich on the hi speed to see if I can get it to 4-stroke all the time, and see if it runs acceptabley well.
I suppose what are the odds that 62 year old seals can still work adequately?
I suppose what are the odds that 62 year old seals can still work adequately?
Pic inside the carb, you can kinda see the metering lever, and the old diaphragm. 
Have you changed the carb parts? That is an old style lever and it looks like it has seen some miles. Definitely get the modern kit. Carb diaphragms don't last forever.
Also, the carb adjustment needles have o-rings on them. If those leak, you can have tuning problems. They are 006 or 007 size orings. Hard to say, I have both. Change them, rule that out.
All the diaphragms are brand new, and the kit came with a new lever, needle and seat assembly, I opted to leave the originals as they are different and looked good. I could certainly try swapping to the new parts if I can't sort my tuning issue...
Where are the O rings located on the adjustment needles? I've never even heard of such a thing, crazy. Are they accessible from the outside of the carb??
