PPE confrontation!

[Cantdog]

Unfortunately, this is not an argument that one will win when going against those people who are too macho for safety gear or so self absorbed as to understand how their actions may impact themselves and others. I wonder how many of the people who refuse protect themselves have health, disability and/or workers compensation insurance in the event of an accident?

What suddenly was their business now becomes a burden for all. I just do not understand why someone would refuse to lessen a risk if a cheap and available solution is presented. Perhaps the federal government will fund a grant in order for me to determine the correlation between smoling, education, socioeconomic background, NRA membership and the use of safety gear.

I'm positive they would.........................you might as well get your cut before the invalids require any...............(?)

 

[jra1100]

Most everything that needs to be said about PPE has already been said. That however won't stop me from putting in my 2 cents worth. I'm probably on the upper end of the age group here, (almost 60) and I've been cutting wood since I was in my teens. That said I knew nothing much about chainsaws and never used any PPE until I was in my 30's, thought that it was for pussies. I was mostly lucky, I still have good vision, not the 20/12 that I once had, but pretty good. Hearing is OK, but CS, guns etc. have taken some toll. Almost never cut myself, cut my jeans and left a red line that didn't leak, that don't count, much. The point being that when I joined this site I was older, somewhat wiser, and had never heard to chaps. The forestry video with the hams did it for me. I won't claim that I never cut without them, but it is rare when I don't have them on, along with the helmet with both hearing and eye protection. I think that mentioning PPE now and then IS a public service, cause there are I'm sure others who come to this site unaware of all the PPE. As mentioned by others you can learn a lot here, I did. In my real job I'm an insurance agent and agency owner. I have had few claims for chainsaw accidents, but the ones that have happened were pretty bad. Someone on here had "If your going to be stupid, you better be tough" in their sig and I is very true. When it comes to protecting yourself it's stupid not to take every advantage, and when it comes to chainsaws you aint tough enough. As for cost, that is a "trap" argument. You can't amortize the cost of PPE working almost always against the constant opportunity of having something go wrong. The cost of ER care is far in excess of the cost of PPE especially if you go "naked" (without health insurance) in further cost containment efforts. If you can't afford health insurance and/or PPE, you sure as hell can't afford to run a chainsaw. I freely admit that if I were reading what I have just written back when I was 25 I'd say that I was full of s**t, but by some miracle I have live to this age relatively unscathed. Take it for what it's worth. JR

 

[discounthunter]

Who says it's your responsibilty?

With this type of mentality, how many times in a day could you correct people with everything done wrong?

Those that feel the need to correct others obviously think they go through life perfectly.

when the poor soul cuts his leg and cant work goes on unemployment,he is now my responsibility,why? because its MY tax money that will pay him for his mistake.

or he goes to the hospital has NO insurance, i have to pay the bill,thru my insureance premiums and taxes.

theres too many what -ifs and couldas that can happen when ppe is NOT worn, very few things go wrong when you simply wear it.

 

[DJ4wd]

so you start a thread nagging about people nagging about being safe.

how old are you, please tell us how long you,ve been around to achieve your infinite wisdom of who should and shouldnt use ppe.

btw a full set of ppe is cheaper than ONE visit to the ER.

Did you even read my post? Were you able to understand the part about where I agree ppe is a good thing or where I said I use it and want more? Are you able to tell the difference between asking people to lay off the constant nagging sometimes 2-3 times a thread over the same thing and Me saying PPE is bad? which I didn't.

See how this works is you read the post and then let it sink in ...wait for it. Then if you understand what it was about ,and only then do you make a comment.
Lets pretend you did not respond and make yourself look foolish.


To make plain what I said..I love PPE and want more.
PPE is good
Injury bad
Nagging over PPE to an active user of PPE, bad
Reminding new members or those not using PPE , Good
Wishing you well
DJ

 

[smokinj]

I cant stand the site of my own blood so it is a very natural choice for myself. I have rush a buddy to the hospital for laying a 390 with the brake not working over hes knee no chaps on.

 

[AUSSIE1]

when the poor soul cuts his leg and cant work goes on unemployment,he is now my responsibility,why? because its MY tax money that will pay him for his mistake.

or he goes to the hospital has NO insurance, i have to pay the bill,thru my insureance premiums and taxes.

theres too many what -ifs and couldas that can happen when ppe is NOT worn, very few things go wrong when you simply wear it.

In some states of your country is it not, not compulsory to wear a crash helmet?
So do you approach a bike rider at a set of lights and give him a lecture about not wearing a helmet? If he is injured, your taxes will pay!

Wear a bumper sticker stating helmets save lives.

 

[rms61moparman]

when the poor soul cuts his leg and cant work goes on unemployment,he is now my responsibility,why? because its MY tax money that will pay him for his mistake.

You can't draw unemployment unless you are willing and able to work.
So someone laid up from a chainsaw injury won't be collecting any of your precious tax dollars.
They will ALL be available to give as welfare to some sorry scab on the backside of society.

You will have to find another excuse to mind someone's business other than your own!

There are myriad reasons to wear PPE, I do it every day, and I don't mind some kibbutzing "rooster vacuum" posting the obligatory "you should wear your PPE" post in my threads.
However, the second (insert your favorite anatomical descriptive here) that comes along and wants to get his fix of "See what a big man I am because I can find and point out all of the things you did wrong" gives me a SERIOUS case of diaper rash!!!

You can make all of the excuses that you want, you can try to explain it away if you so desire, but the fact remains that you are nothing but the neighborhood "Eighty year old, little old lady" busybody who doesn't have enough of your own business to mind so you feel important by minding someone elses!!!

I am wholeheartedly behind the people who, when someone starts a "What saw should I buy" thread, point out the need for PPE and extoll its virtues. They are doing a service to the forum and the poster.
But for goodness sakes learn when you are just being a nuisance!


Mike

 

[rattler362]

I am what you would call a recreational cutter, though I also own a sawmill that is currently sitting idle. Back in the summer of 1988 I was cutting some timber at my mother's property. It was the end of the day and I had one more log to section and the saw got pinched. Grabbed another saw and started it and while stepping over another log put a 4" gash across my knee. Pure carelessness on my part.

Fortunately I was within walking (limping) distance of the house and suffered little blood loss. Took my first ambulance ride and thirty some stitches later I was back together. I immediately ordered a set of chaps from Bailey's that I am still using. In the grand scale of things they were cheap, less than half the cost of the bottle of pain pills I required.

I suspect that some people think they have been doing it so long that nothing can happen to them. In my most recent job I was the risk manager for a Fortune 500 company and I can tell you that accidents can and will happen. Any steps you can take to mitigate the hazards of the job will only help you in the long run.

A few day's ago i had almost had the same thing happen i cut a nice white oak and the top was blocking the driveway so i had to trim it out it was hot i was tired i had cut most of the limb's off and was trying to wade through them got my foot hung when i jerked my leg up my saw cut the knee out of my jean's barely scrached my knee now you talk about a wake up call i will have a pair of chap's and i will wear them.

Mike

 

[roncoinc]

when the poor soul cuts his leg and cant work goes on unemployment,he is now my responsibility,why? because its MY tax money that will pay him for his mistake.

or he goes to the hospital has NO insurance, i have to pay the bill,thru my insureance premiums and taxes.

theres too many what -ifs and couldas that can happen when ppe is NOT worn, very few things go wrong when you simply wear it.

"VERY" few things go wrong when you wear PPE ?? LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
got to a veterans hospital this weekend and show your support for all those you see injured that WERE wearing PPE and are now disabled..guys that YOU are paying for,,guys that ARE your responability,,AND you ARE paying for thru your taxes..guys that YOU sent out there to get killed and maimed so YOU can complain about somebody choosing not to wear PPE because you may have to pay for it LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!
it's a "FREE" country dammit !!! people can CHOOSE !!
if you dont like living in a free country MOVE !!

 

[Modifiedmark]

You can't draw unemployment unless you are willing and able to work.
So someone laid up from a chainsaw injury won't be collecting any of your precious tax dollars.
They will ALL be available to give as welfare to some sorry scab on the backside of society.

You will have to find another excuse to mind someone's business other than your own!

There are myriad reasons to wear PPE, I do it every day, and I don't mind some kibbutzing "rooster vacuum" posting the obligatory "you should wear your PPE" post in my threads.
However, the second (insert your favorite anatomical descriptive here) that comes along and wants to get his fix of "See what a big man I am because I can find and point out all of the things you did wrong" gives me a SERIOUS case of diaper rash!!!

You can make all of the excuses that you want, you can try to explain it away if you so desire, but the fact remains that you are nothing but the neighborhood "Eighty year old, little old lady" busybody who doesn't have enough of your own business to mind so you feel important by minding someone elses!!!

I am wholeheartedly behind the people who, when someone starts a "What saw should I buy" thread, point out the need for PPE and extoll its virtues. They are doing a service to the forum and the poster.
But for goodness sakes learn when you are just being a nuisance!


Mike

:agree2::agree2::agree2:


Pretty much right on there. I go through so much goofy PPE crap at work each day its past the point of stupid.

I sure aint going to listen to someone who isnt paying me, tell me what I need to do on my own time.

 

[discounthunter]

"VERY" few things go wrong when you wear PPE ?? LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
got to a veterans hospital this weekend and show your support for all those you see injured that WERE wearing PPE and are now disabled..guys that YOU are paying for,,guys that ARE your responability,,AND you ARE paying for thru your taxes..guys that YOU sent out there to get killed and maimed so YOU can complain about somebody choosing not to wear PPE because you may have to pay for it LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!
it's a "FREE" country dammit !!! people can CHOOSE !!
if you dont like living in a free country MOVE !!

dont post crap like that. think of all the men saved because of ppe. flank jackets alone save thousands.no they are not fool proof nothing is,but with nothing people dont stand a chance.dont tell me to go to a veterans hospital,i worked in one ive worked on soldiers with every injury you can possible dream of and then some.the original nagger who posted this thread said he doesnt like naggers well too bad. he opened himself up but cant take it.try thicker ppe.

the ppe in question is sawing not military nor police use.so steo down of you rstump and chill out.

 

[roncoinc]

dont post crap like that. think of all the men saved because of ppe. flank jackets alone save thousands.no they are not fool proof nothing is,but with nothing people dont stand a chance.dont tell me to go to a veterans hospital,i worked in one ive worked on soldiers with every injury you can possible dream of and then some.the original nagger who posted this thread said he doesnt like naggers well too bad. he opened himself up but cant take it.try thicker ppe.

the ppe in question is sawing not military nor police use.so steo down of you rstump and chill out.

YOU said "very few things happen when your wear PPE " didnt you ???

remember that ???????
did YOU ever wear a flak jacket ?? i think you are just a poser
NOBODY likes naggers,,are you TRYING to be unpopular on purpose ??
is that the only attention you can get ??
DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO !!! YOU ARE "NOBODY" TO ME !! MIND YOUR OWN BIZZ !!
can you understand that ??
probly not,has already been said,read up.. enjoy your attention..

 

[BobL]

Who says it's your responsibilty?

With this type of mentality, how many times in a day could you correct people with everything done wrong?

Those that feel the need to correct others obviously think they go through life perfectly.

I don't see anyone posting a comment about PPE as being any different to any other comment or advice posted on this site. Isn't this what this forum is about ? Why should commenting on everything else (including taking the piss) about chainsaws (and more) be permitted but not PPE?

There are also many other things comments and advice offered on in this forum that have as much to do with safety as PPE. Someone has already mentioned stumps, poorly sharpened chains, poorly tied down loads, loose saws in the backs of station wagons, poor cutting position, etc. Are you suggesting we don't discuss any of these either?

Indirectly there are even more things tied to safety. Anything that leads to a fatigued operator is a safety issue so efficient saw operation, tuning and use of the best available saws - are we still allowed to discuss those.

 

[discounthunter]

YOU said "very few things happen when your wear PPE " didnt you ???

remember that ???????
did YOU ever wear a flak jacket ?? i think you are just a poser
NOBODY likes naggers,,are you TRYING to be unpopular on purpose ??
is that the only attention you can get ??
DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO !!! YOU ARE "NOBODY" TO ME !! MIND YOUR OWN BIZZ !!
can you understand that ??
probly not,has already been said,read up.. enjoy your attention..

gosh golly you win. im just a poser you know all about me .

 

[roncoinc]

I don't see anyone posting a comment about PPE as being any different to any other comment or advice posted on this site. Isn't this what this forum is about ? Why should commenting on everything else (including taking the piss) about chainsaws (and more) be permitted but not PPE?

There are also many other things comments and advice offered on in this forum that have as much to do with safety as PPE. Someone has already mentioned stumps, poorly sharpened chains, poorly tied down loads, loose saws in the backs of station wagons, poor cutting position, etc. Are you suggesting we don't discuss any of these either?

Indirectly there are even more things tied to safety. Anything that leads to a fatigued operator is a safety issue so efficient saw operation, tuning and use of the best available saws - are we still allowed to discuss those.

Sure Bob,,as long as you dont needlessly nag,annoy and propose that your way is the only acceptable way and everybody else is wrong..and let people make thier own choices ..discussion is good,condeming not good..
you seem to do fine..

 

[AUSSIE1]

I don't see anyone posting a comment about PPE as being any different to any other comment or advice posted on this site. Isn't this what this forum is about ? Why should commenting on everything else (including taking the piss) about chainsaws (and more) be permitted but not PPE?

There are also many other things comments and advice offered on in this forum that have as much to do with safety as PPE. Someone has already mentioned stumps, poorly sharpened chains, poorly tied down loads, loose saws in the backs of station wagons, poor cutting position, etc. Are you suggesting we don't discuss any of these either?

Indirectly there are even more things tied to safety. Anything that leads to a fatigued operator is a safety issue so efficient saw operation, tuning and use of the best available saws - are we still allowed to discuss those.

No you don't see any difference between posting a comment about someone wearing PPE and any other comment. That's obvious. This is what some of us are trying to make you and others aware. Why should we have to wear a comment because you are fine with it. Some here smoke and do so while cutting or working in their workshop with no comments made. Good. Nobody else's "direct" problem. Some may have a drink or two. Everyone here does things differently and to different levels of responsibility. So what do we do? Go around correcting everyone all the time? I'm sure that most wouldn't put a constructive comment about a chain, file etc in the same category as this. Who says taking the piss out of someones saw is correct.

This post wasn't about whether PPE is good or not as there is no argument.
It's about whether we need the PPE police to make repeated remarks.

 

[BobL]

Sure Bob,,as long as you dont needlessly nag,annoy and propose that your way is the only acceptable way and everybody else is wrong..and let people make thier own choices ..discussion is good,condeming not good..
you seem to do fine..

Cheers roncoinc.

I do find it interesting that we can endlessly nag nag nage and continually take the piss about saw brands, chain types, trucks, burgers and yadda yadda but somehow PPE is exempt form this?

All together now - Steel - Huski - Steel - Huski - Steeeeel, Huskiiiiii, STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, . . . . . . . . STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, ., . . .(poulan) , WTF? . . . someone cut that man outta the ranks and call the CS poulice!

 

[Cantdog]

In some states of your country is it not, not compulsory to wear a crash helmet?
So do you approach a bike rider at a set of lights and give him a lecture about not wearing a helmet? If he is injured, your taxes will pay!

Wear a bumper sticker stating helmets save lives.

LOL Some try AUSSIE1 but up here our saying is "LOUD pipes save lives"

I have nothing against PPE or any other safety devises but people tend to assume that if they wear safety equipment then they are "safe" and that is misleading at best. The best safety devise is knowing what you're doing and not becoming complacent while running any saw or other machinery.

I mean how many times do you see the "classic" safe MC rider? Generally riding a 150 RWHP 4 cyl monster wearing absolute state of the art $700 helmet with shorts, Tee shirt and Tevas????? I mean why save the head???? If you can't hit the tar and survive what's the point?
The hand wringers think that safety can/should be legislated but legislation alone is just an illusion of safety.
A good example of this mistaken thought process is evident in an earlier post picturing a poor guy severely lacerated in the face/mouth. I have to ask would chaps helped? Gloves? Would the screen face shield on his helmet stopped the saw? What safety equipment would have prevented this? Everyone should think about this, he may have been doing everything by the book but a pic like this does nothing to promote PPE at all. You can up the odds in your favor but you must remember the when using a chainsaw, motorcycle, auto, air nailer or anything else something could happen at any time and no matter what you're wearing at the time you may not be as safe as you want to believe.

Bad things happen to good people and it sucks. There are an infinite number of ways to hurt yourself and sometimes all the nagging and laws can't stop it from happening. You are your own best safety devise. Use your head and do what you feel safe with, and not what someone else thinks is best for you. Again just my opinion but it's also the way I live my life.

 

[Guido Salvage]

I think the central theme is that the people who use PPE are all for it, those that choose not to think they are safe and berate the safety messengers for meddling.

Do me a favor, if you do decide to go without protection:

A) Have a paid up health insurance policy and the means to keep it in place without an income stream,
B) Private disability insurance that will pay you for your lost time without having to resort to my tax dollars,
C) Ample savings to tide you over so that you do not have to rely upon any taxpayer assistance,
D) Burial benefits in the event you fail to survive your actions.

If you can document for me that your refusal to follow simple safety steps will not have any financial or social impact on me, I can accept your decision. However, when your stubbornness and unwillingness to take simple safety precautions spills beyond your family and costs me money, I think it prudent to show you the error of your ways. Especially since protection is so cost effective and improves the probability you can continue to function and do your job.

The real question I have is why you would not use PPE? Can anyone provide a valid reason for avoiding something potentially lifesaving?

 

[roncoinc]

Cheers roncoinc.

I do find it interesting that we can endlessly nag nag nage and continually take the piss about saw brands, chain types, trucks, burgers and yadda yadda but somehow PPE is exempt form this?

All together now - Steel - Huski - Steel - Huski - Steeeeel, Huskiiiiii, STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, . . . . . . . . STEEEEEEL, HUSKIIIIIII, ., . . .(poulan) , WTF? . . . someone cut that man outta the ranks and call the CS poulice!

Bob,,i think the reason amongst most has to do with the first letter of PPE..
suggesting to those that arent aware of it is one thing,nagging and condeming lack of is another thing..
sawyers seem to be an independent type of person and getting "personal" with them may draw some ire trying to tell a man how to take care of his body is not appreciated by some..
i dont wear seat belts,i dont wear a helmet and i dont wear chaps..
MY choice...
thats why PPE is exempt..