Sthil MS 461 vs Stihl MS 660 Dyno tested

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I'll test the saws again tonight with an 8 pin. This should get the low rpm torque I'm thinking the 660 has greatly over the 461
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Keep up the good work Chadiman. I've been following your dyno build threads since you started them and am very impressed with your build. I used to work for a diesel engine manufacturer back in the eighties and the standard way of testing them was with water brakes. Basically the engine turned a turbine supported in trunnions and the torque was measured by an arm with a glorified spring balance (with counterweighting for different power outputs so as not to go overscale) Yes the water got hot and the valving had to be adjusted to allow for it but it made no difference to the torque being measured.
You will have losses from the chain drive so you won't get the crankshaft figures quoted from the manufacturers. But surprise surprise a chainsaw won't cut wood without a bar and chain attached to it so the readings you are getting will be much more real world. Cars are tested on rolling roads and the figures aren't what the factories quote at the crank.
You could correct for temperature, humidity and barometric pressure but comparisons on a given day compared to a base saw like you have been doing are just fine. Even after correction I know from experience that the SAE and ISO standards allow a lot of wriggle room for the statisticians to get the answers that the marketing department were after.
I also admire your patience in answering all the naysayers who have been on your back but trust me you are on the right lines:rock:
 
Hers a short video to just show how the rotating pump housing works and how the torque arm has vibration dampers that flex as a preset load is applied.[video=youtube_share;eFcdx5Cyl04]http://youtu.be/eFcdx5Cyl04[/video]
 
Torque

Did you say your set up recorded ft lbs and you extrapolated HP, or do you do it the other way around?
I am curious to see the % difference in torque between these two saws.
 
Did you say your set up recorded ft lbs and you extrapolated HP, or do you do it the other way around?
I am curious to see the % difference in torque between these two saws.

I record torque then figure Hp from torque and rpms
 
Wish we were closet I have a few Saws that would be fun to test. Ported 660s can be built to scream. I have ran a few nasty ones.

I ran a fresh 660 up at the OH GTG in June that Copsey ported, and that baby made luscious torque - one bad dude. :rock:
 
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Exactly. He just had a 660 literally go off the scales, and everyone is shouting "4 6 1, 4 6 1!". Am I the only one that finds this odd?

The 660 pulled heavy torque and my dyno ran out of muscle to hold it below 8000 rpms. I could pull my 460 down until the clutch slipped around 4000 rpms. I could pull the 461 down to 6500 or so. The hyd pump actually smoked when I tried to pull the 660 down lower. That's why I said lets not bash the 660. Who knows maybe the 660 will have 50% more torque at 6000 rpms. The 460 and 461 max hp is around 9000 rpms and the 660 kept gaining hp the harder I pulled it so maybe it will have the 1 hp more like stihls specs say.

Sorry guys, I'm not going to get to retest tonight. I got a 9 pin sprocket today but I need a little longer cutterless chain for it. My plan is to get a little higher flow pump so I can kill the big ported saws without having to add a nine pin sprocket. The next size northern tool pump will bolt right in and the shaft size is the same.
 
Is there any reason to test the RPMs that low? A saw should not be lugged that low in normal operation.

The big bars will get you down In low rpms sometimes. The smaller saws stall while the higher torque saws can handle it. It's also just fun to make them grunt.
 
Maybre it's just me, but if I see someone reefing on a saw like that, I figure they either need to sharpen their chain, and/or learn how to operate it. That's hard on the saw and operator.

You never had a saw grab and stall? High torque saws are not as easy to stall. It's exactly why the 660 shines with a big bar buried. My chains are always sharp.:rock: And I'll make my saws cry if I want to.:mad2: Reefing has something to do with a sail boat not a chainsaw:biggrin:
Just sayin
 
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