A & E...The art and Zen of the Grunt (Groundworker)

[vaclimber]

rare find

I've had some good ones and still do. Some have passed on. My first groundie was in his 40's when I started out in my early 20's. He died young. Had another good one pass on as well. Longtime ex girlfriend's step dad. He was in his 50's when he worked for me and would work from sunup to sundown and never complain. Worked circles around the younger guys. Also, the guy who first put me in a tree used to groundie for me while I climbed. The deal was I still had to do ground work too when I came down though.

I have never been the type to sit on my ass when the tree is on the ground. LOL, I would say that I still work the hardest on the ground than any of my crew. I like to run the ground operation when I have an apprentice climber too. It's fun teaching someone to climb and as has been mentioned, no one can run the ropes better than a climber. Also, if you are the owner or even the crew chief it is good to spend some time on the ground with your guys. If you're the crew chief or owner, odds are that you have the most experience. It's good to get down with the ground crew and teach them the shortcuts and best way to do things. It's simple arithmetic after you have been doing it for a lot of years but not so to newer guys. Simple things like the natural order of cleanup, how to run a saw, get the truck closer to the brush pile to make shorter trips. All common sense but newer guys still need to be shown the best way. It makes for a better more cohesive team when you take the time to show your guys the shortcuts and let them know that you don't think yourself above ground work. When they see you know how to do it well and there is a reason that you tell them to do things in a certain order they tend to have a lot more respect for you.

Unfortunately, there isn't a surplus of sober, responsible, dedicated, teachable, motivated folk who are seeking employment as a "ground-man." I have a great one(after years of patience and relearning, myself included) who is vital to maximizing efficiency on the job. I believe crew members are an investment that when prov en unwise should be dropped with haste, but when beneficial, should be given all that is needed(and then some) to increase. I pay my guy well and don't take him for granted and his loyalty is priceless. Too many times employers pinch pennies in the labor department and another "mercenary" tree-worker is added to the ranks. After all my life is literally in his hands much of the time.

 

[treevet]

Unfortunately, there isn't a surplus of sober, responsible, dedicated, teachable, motivated folk who are seeking employment as a "ground-man." I have a great one(after years of patience and relearning, myself included) who is vital to maximizing efficiency on the job. I believe crew members are an investment that when prov en unwise should be dropped with haste, but when beneficial, should be given all that is needed(and then some) to increase. I pay my guy well and don't take him for granted and his loyalty is priceless. Too many times employers pinch pennies in the labor department and another "mercenary" tree-worker is added to the ranks. After all my life is literally in his hands much of the time.

I could write a long novel about all the ground men (1 woman) I have had over 41 years from the Jamaican that was 65 and would boggle the mind how hard he could work. He was in the Olympics. Spoke zero English. To the gm that actually lived under a bridge by the Delaware River. Some fascinating memories there.

I would say the best way to keep a good groundman in this day and age besides treating and paying him fairly is

hand him the keys to a mini skid with a grapple.

 

[TreeTarget]

I could write a long novel about all the ground men (1 woman) I have had over 41 years from the Jamaican that was 65 and would boggle the mind how hard he could work. He was in the Olympics. Spoke zero English. To the gm that actually lived under a bridge by the Delaware River. Some fascinating memories there.

I would say the best way to keep a good groundman in this day and age besides treating and paying him fairly is

hand him the keys to a mini skid with a grapple.

I don't care much for the toys...operated alot of things throughout the past, so equipment doesn't tickle my fancy.
What keeps me around (even if the boss isn't a friend), is a boss that understands that I may not, and that enlightenment to the problem and/or solution doesn't necessitate screaming curses at me from a tree like a pissed off, poo-flinging monkey.
I am a patient person, and sometimes not the quickest learner when it comes to intricate knots and such--especially when those knots, rigs and the like are not used everyday. To be able to communicate and teach with patience is the hallmark of the ideal boss.
I fully understand that frustrations can run high, and sometimes time, labor, weather and a multitude of other factors are going to be buzzing around the boss's mind while he is suspended above the ground. Getting bent out of shape and being an ass will not help the situation, I am sure...and no shiny equipment or afternoon meals or %age increase in wages are going to keep me from walking away.
I like my job...don't need thanks, congrats, "good job..."
Never did like being yelled at or being talked to like a moron, though.
I don't ask for much, 'cause I know there is alot of room for improvement...
But I do give my all...

 

[vaclimber]

no doubt!

I could write a long novel about all the ground men (1 woman) I have had over 41 years from the Jamaican that was 65 and would boggle the mind how hard he could work. He was in the Olympics. Spoke zero English. To the gm that actually lived under a bridge by the Delaware River. Some fascinating memories there.

I would say the best way to keep a good groundman in this day and age besides treating and paying him fairly is

hand him the keys to a mini skid with a grapple.

Very true, providing he(or she) can be turf friendly when needed, wont bomb the trucks, maintains it properly, is safe & aware,.....,......,.....I'm all about mechanical advantage, but a good groundsman, to me, contributes beyond areas of debris and manual labor. Hes an artist with the ropes and is constantly looking to make my "air time" as effortless as possible while looking out constantly for any safety issues. But he does love his Bobcat!

 

[vaclimber]

No place for tempers

I don't care much for the toys...operated alot of things throughout the past, so equipment doesn't tickle my fancy.
What keeps me around (even if the boss isn't a friend), is a boss that understands that I may not, and that enlightenment to the problem and/or solution doesn't necessitate screaming curses at me from a tree like a pissed off, poo-flinging monkey.
I am a patient person, and sometimes not the quickest learner when it comes to intricate knots and such--especially when those knots, rigs and the like are not used everyday. To be able to communicate and teach with patience is the hallmark of the ideal boss.
I fully understand that frustrations can run high, and sometimes time, labor, weather and a multitude of other factors are going to be buzzing around the boss's mind while he is suspended above the ground. Getting bent out of shape and being an ass will not help the situation, I am sure...and no shiny equipment or afternoon meals or %age increase in wages are going to keep me from walking away.
I like my job...don't need thanks, congrats, "good job..."
Never did like being yelled at or being talked to like a moron, though.
I don't ask for much, 'cause I know there is alot of room for improvement...
But I do give my all...

I dig it! Lets solve the problem, not be one.

 

[TreeTarget]

Rain week...

Going to be alot of shop-time going on this week...thunder storms forecast for most every day, so unless there is a break, not going to be alot of work outside.

 

[TreeTarget]

Worked today...not a big job, just a few 5-8 inch b. pears, a few trims and alot of brush. Wouldn't really call it work, as I limped around singing beach boys songs to keep my mind off the foot.
Boss set me up with a little breakfast before I started, and I think he did alot more work than I did. As luck would have it, trailer was in the front, a gate to go through and about 30-50 yards from the falls in the back yard to the trailer in the front driveway...
Just another normal, uneventful, easy day with no surprises...Funny how a bum ankle can paint a whole new picture of the same old grind. Sitting now with foot and calf in a 5 gallon bucket of epsom salt-water and self medicating with advil and negra modelo (no, not a colourful hottie, a Mexican beer). We will see what tomorrow brings, but can honestly say, am not looking forward to it where this foot is concerned. Told the boss I may not be able to pull it off tomorrow, but who knows...at least the weather was close to perfect today, 87 degrees and 60% humidity...can't wait 'till summer.

 

[IcePick]

the weather was close to perfect today, 87 degrees and 60% humidity...can't wait 'till summer.

87 degrees to me is 20 degrees too warm. Don't get me wrong it gets hot and humid up here (87 degrees today), but I wouldn't do well down south.

 

[TreeTarget]

87 degrees to me is 20 degrees too warm. Don't get me wrong it gets hot and humid up here (87 degrees today), but I wouldn't do well down south.

That's what the boss says...can't understand why that eskimo is even down this far...and this is just the upper south...would never see him living any farther...

 

[TreeTarget]

Been away for a bit, but still around. Haven't been working much on the ground--guess people are still stricken by last month's heat wave, so have been spending alot of time in the shop, studying stuff, trying out that and other stuff, and hoping to somehow turn it into something others want to hand over cash in order to make it their stuff. Been learning alot of new techniques and applications. Mainly, what I seem to be learning is that I don't have enough money for what I now know. Should have kept the bliss of ignorance and stuck with the duh...no turning back now I guess.

 

[ForTheArborist]

I just hired a new groundman. He was the best one I found so far - quick learner, always a step ahead of me, doesn't BS too much, really good worker. I went home after his first day thinking how good this worker is, and then I get a letter from him saying he doesn't think he is cut out for tree work. I wrote him back two big letters painting the picture so bright and clean, and I offered him a $2 raise if he sticks for 10 more work days. I knew after all the other guys I've hired that this guy was good for business, and I would have been kicking my own butt for a long time for letting him get away. The right players right now make a lot of difference.

Another thing about him is he owns a hauling/demo business that he does part time, so he's on the same page as a self-motivated worker.

 

[tree MDS]

I just hired a new groundman. He was the best one I found so far - quick learner, always a step ahead of me, doesn't BS too much, really good worker. I went home after his first day thinking how good this worker is, and then I get a letter from him saying he doesn't think he is cut out for tree work. I wrote him back two big letters painting the picture so bright and clean, and I offered him a $2 raise if he sticks for 10 more work days. I knew after all the other guys I've hired that this guy was good for business, and I would have been kicking my own butt for a long time for letting him get away. The right players right now make a lot of difference.

Another thing about him is he owns a hauling/demo business that he does part time, so he's on the same page as a self-motivated worker.

I can't say I blame him.. beginner style treework sucks the big one.

 

[treevet]

I just hired a new groundman. He was the best one I found so far - quick learner, always a step ahead of me, doesn't BS too much, really good worker. I went home after his first day thinking how good this worker is, and then I get a letter from him saying he doesn't think he is cut out for tree work. I wrote him back two big letters painting the picture so bright and clean, and I offered him a $2 raise if he sticks for 10 more work days. I knew after all the other guys I've hired that this guy was good for business, and I would have been kicking my own butt for a long time for letting him get away. The right players right now make a lot of difference.

Another thing about him is he owns a hauling/demo business that he does part time, so he's on the same page as a self-motivated worker.

The problem likely is that he has his own gig and 2 bucks an hr. prob ain't gonna get it. Often they don't think what they can make when they are slow but rather just think about all the bucks they are making when busy.

Hard to work for someone else when you had your own thing. Only person I have worked for in last 42 years is Uncle Sammy for 2.

 

[TreeTarget]

Can't say what I like more, working in the shop or on the ground. Two bucks more an hour would help, but if the other things pay off enough, I would be hard pressed to want to get out more than twice a week. Right now, I don't have to worry, as it is still slow, so the shop gets all my time. Creativity and actual production is great. But, being more into ground work due to the fresh air and activity...would be a tough choice, if there were enough work.

 

[TreeTarget]

Was cutting up a big, dead oak yesterday. Had a pulled muscle in my back, so was really happy to have been toting no more than the boss's 346 for the job. Had a bobcat on site, and no cleanup other than the bc moving all the limbs and firewood/trunk cookies.
The other gm is working today, so going to do the shop thing after mowing. Might actually get all the pewter formed today for the mirror.

 

[TreeTarget]

Sore, tired and three days off...

 

[TreeTarget]

Worked in the shop today since I was up most of the night with the boy...he doesn't even remember being awake or sick...work tomorrow

 

[TonyX3M]

Here's one for you climbers!

I started as a groundman- my father-in-law thought that it was a good way for a payback (I'll show for that darn foreigner how REAL men work) - long story short - after six months I had to start climbing 'cause after I was done on the ground I asked him not to go home- hell I needed the money( most of the ground crew is always under-payed) so I went up a tree, took it down, chipped the brush and cleaned up... I still can't understand climbers who think that ground job is like no-no for them- get your head out of your arse and don't think you are something special -if you are a real treeman you do it all -and dont think that working on the ground is degrading for you!
As of finding good and real groundman - I know it is hard -I'm almost in worst position of all - my groundy is my boss- and it aint easy, although hes getting pretty decent- exept I always get an "good" advice how to do things ....

 

[treeslayer]

I still can't understand climbers who think that ground job is like no-no for them- get your head out of your arse and don't think you are something special -if you are a real treeman you do it all -and dont think that working on the ground is degrading for you!

real treemen want to make $$ not labor needlessly. get your head out of your own arse and own a business, you'll figure that out quick.

climbers climbing to make $$ is the bottom line.

 

[TonyX3M]

real treemen want to make $$ not labor needlessly. get your head out of your own arse and own a business, you'll figure that out quick.

climbers climbing to make $$ is the bottom line.

And I was thinking we all do it just for fun!:hmm3grin2orange: