Modders beware!!!

[Hddnis]

Ignoring the law is, yes.

No it is not.

A law cannot determine either morals or ethics. It can only determine what is legal and what is not. This is by definition; a law simply cannot claim to rise to that level of authority. This has long been recognized by the legal profession, courts, and our various law making bodies.

That is why every state has laws which allow their laws to be broken when following those laws would result in greater harm.



Mr. HE

 

[THALL10326]

So who is responsible with modded saws as far as emissions are conserned?
The owner of the saw?
Or the modder being paid?

Thats a good question but if I had to choose who would get the fine it would be the modder. If he knows how to mod well enuff to be paid for it he most certainly knows he's altering the emissions of the saw he is modding. The owner is merely buying goods or services and his excuse would be I didn't know. Same went for cars back in the 70-80's Many shops got fined bigtime for unhooking hoses and such on the emissions systems of cars. Nowdays you couldn't pay any shop to alter the emission system on cars.

EPA has won the war, simple as that, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

 

[Hddnis]

Oh, I was unaware that Space is a lawyer. Well, that explains the lecture on the importance of ethics and morals.

Yeah, the thankfully small (and I mean that in all its implications) segment of society that talks it but can't walk it.



Mr. HE

 

[Hddnis]

Thats a good question but if I had to choose who would get the fine it would be the modder. If he knows how to mod well enuff to be paid for it he most certainly knows he's altering the emissions of the saw he is modding. The owner is merely buying goods or services and his excuse would be I didn't know. Same went for cars back in the 70-80's Many shops got fined bigtime for unhooking hoses and such on the emissions systems of cars. Nowdays you couldn't pay any shop to alter the emission system on cars.

EPA has won the war, simple as that, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

I wouldn't go so far as to say they won the war, but I'd agree they won that battle; mostly because nobody stood up to them. They got the laws passed with lobby money from overseas automakers that were having a hard time breaking into the US market. They hid the money by having it come from wholly owned domestic subsidiaries.

I don't really see any strong challenge to this latest power grab, it would have to come it the form of a SCOTUS ruling restricting a whole number of agencies based on properly defining the exploited interstate commerce clause.

Thanks for posting the heads up. It never hurts to know where the hurt is coming from next.



Mr. HE

 

[danrclem]

Nowdays you couldn't pay any shop to alter the emission system on cars.

EPA has won the war, simple as that, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Back in 1979 I bought a new truck that had a catalytic converter on it. I took the converter off and reamed the hole out where you put the gas in and proceeded to run leaded gas in it. We had emissions testing in the county that I lived and the day that I took my truck to be tested it had leaded gas in it. I was going to put unleaded gas in it before testing but forgot to. Guess what, the truck passed the emissions test with flying colors.

 

[AUSSIE1]

Thats a good question but if I had to choose who would get the fine it would be the modder. If he knows how to mod well enuff to be paid for it he most certainly knows he's altering the emissions of the saw he is modding. The owner is merely buying goods or services and his excuse would be I didn't know. Same went for cars back in the 70-80's Many shops got fined bigtime for unhooking hoses and such on the emissions systems of cars. Nowdays you couldn't pay any shop to alter the emission system on cars.

EPA has won the war, simple as that, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Probably one for Space, but if a saw is modified but never used, is this in breach of emission laws ?

 

[Jtheo]

New Phase III EPA Regulations
STIHL Inc. is providing you with this notification from the U.S. EPA of the responsibilities and liabilities being imposed upon the importers, distributors, and retailers of outdoor power equipment that will be subject to the new EPA phase III regulations beginning in 2010. The outreach from the U.S. EPA summarizes these responsibilities and recommends the retailers and importers adapt and implement reasonably prudent precautions to avoid a violation. Violations can carry fines up to $37,500 for each engine or piece of equipment.


How would you like to get caught modding a chainsaw for some guy you don't really know and later he slaps you with a fine of $37,500, ouch!!!!

So the person for whom the saw was modified can slap a $37,500 fine?

You Sure about that????

 

[THALL10326]

Hmmm.... so we should expect a precipitous drop in advertising for porting mods. I do see your point. Or perhaps all porting work in 2010 will be done for free!

Hey just saw that post and its a good post. The advertising may drop off bigtime but that free stuff, ha, that will never happen.

Course the buyers have a recourse now. If they aren't happy with the mod job they can turn the modder into EPA and really piss him off, ouch!!

All kidding aside is it worth the risk. 250.00-300.00 for a mod job and some unhappy knucklehead turns you in, is it worth the risk, not to me..

 

[THALL10326]

So the person for whom the saw was modified can slap a $37,500 fine?

You Sure about that????

Near as I can figure the buyer is not the retailer, the modder is the retailer selling goods and services. I think the fines would be directed at him, not the buyer..

 

[Paul001]

I'm with ya but no its not crap, its the law come 2010. Sucks!!

I see you got the update as well. Interesting section on the E10 stuff too.

Long as it is the end user modifying his own product...folks that do it out of a shop or for others, beware.

 

[sctstoys72]

i aint got that kinda money,now if it were a $200 fine then i,m scared.

 

[Paul001]

BTW, this will be gotten around fairly easily.

Instead of purchasing a 372XP with a muffler mod and port work done, complete. You'll buy the muffler and cylinder...to be installed by the end user.

With a host of disclaimers about how those items are for display purposes only...

 

[THALL10326]

I see you got the update as well. Interesting section on the E10 stuff too.

Long as it is the end user modifying his own product...folks that do it out of a shop or for others, beware.

Yeah I got it. From what I read they mean business, you agree??

 

[Paul001]

Yeah I got it. From what I read they mean business, you agree??

No question, any source of revenue is going to be gone after. They will not bother with the small guy, but shops that have equity, stock, and money in the bank...damn right we'll all be getting a visit.

 

[THALL10326]

No question, any source of revenue is going to be gone after. They will not bother with the small guy, but shops that have equity, stock, and money in the bank...damn right we'll all be getting a visit.

I agree. They can come all they want, this cat tant modding squat, not worth the risk to me,

 

[TraditionalTool]

New Phase III EPA Regulations
STIHL Inc. is providing you with this notification from the U.S. EPA of the responsibilities and liabilities being imposed upon the importers, distributors, and retailers of outdoor power equipment that will be subject to the new EPA phase III regulations beginning in 2010. The outreach from the U.S. EPA summarizes these responsibilities and recommends the retailers and importers adapt and implement reasonably prudent precautions to avoid a violation. Violations can carry fines up to $37,500 for each engine or piece of equipment.


How would you like to get caught modding a chainsaw for some guy you don't really know and later he slaps you with a fine of $37,500, ouch!!!!

That's for retailers.

Seriously, that is who the EPA weenies will go after, do you think they will go after some guy who's modifying chainsaws on his own? Even people that port saw for others, I don't see them as being the target of this...

It's YOU Tommy! It's guys like you that ruin it for all of us!

You low down retailers...:greenchainsaw:

 

[Banacanin]

New Phase III EPA Regulations
STIHL Inc. is providing you with this notification from the U.S. EPA of the responsibilities and liabilities being imposed upon the importers, distributors, and retailers of outdoor power equipment that will be subject to the new EPA phase III regulations beginning in 2010. The outreach from the U.S. EPA summarizes these responsibilities and recommends the retailers and importers adapt and implement reasonably prudent precautions to avoid a violation. Violations can carry fines up to $37,500 for each engine or piece of equipment.


How would you like to get caught modding a chainsaw for some guy you don't really know and later he slaps you with a fine of $37,500, ouch!!!!

I imagine the fine is for selling a new saw that does not meet the standard.

 

[BloodOnTheIce]

They'll have to take my ported, muffler modded, running 32:1 Husky 3120XP from my cold dead hand!.

 

[biggenius29]

Well, dag gom the EPA.
Dont worry modders, I wont tell. If you cut me a deal
Next thing you know... NASCAR will be be outlawed, and they will be racin hybrids.

No, if these moronic Libitards have their way we will all be riding horses and no cars, but everytime the horse farts you will be taxxed.

 

[lambs]

What if the saw just needs to be tuned?

Reading this thread, my question is whether dealers will refuse to work on a modded saw. Or not tune one unless it has a fully stock set up on it.

It will be interesting to see how far the regs go on this.