Need advice for snaged leaning tree

[raventai]

I tried to drop a tree yesterday. I think it is a sweet-gum, it has maple shaped leaves. The wood seems pretty soft for a hard wood. I saw it was intertwined in a live oak branch and chose a direction that would let the trunk pass. But I did not see a side vertical branch that caught the falling tree on the oak branch. The tree I cut is now stuck at about 15* leaning to the east. I was hoping it would fall in the night but no such luck. I need to get it down to continue clearing, as I don't want to work under it as it sits.

I got a rope on the trunk about 30' up and tried to pull. But the snag is solid. Then I tried to get the rope higher for more leverage up in the v / crotch, but I have not been able to get a rope tossed up into that crotch, as it's about 60' up.


Couple of ideas I have had:

Can you put a second hinge a foot or so up or down and 90* to an existing hinge? My current hinge has it leaning to the east, but if I could get it to lean to the north (away from the sun in the pictures) the snag should slip off the branch. But I am not sure of the physics with two hinges, and I am afraid the cut tree will break at the base and come at me.

Another idea: make another notch at the same level as the current notch, but to the north taking out half my current hinge, and then cut my hinge from the south with an ax until it leans off to the north on what remains of the hinge.

I have about 160' of 3/8" twisted nylon rope (boat anchor rode) and can tie off to other trees, but I cannot get very high on the trunk. I have wedges, but have not been able to figure out how to use them here, as my relief cut is already open too far.

To the north and west I have more trees, to the south a shed and power lines. So to the east is best. I can go slightly northeast or slightly southeast.

Any advice on how to safely get this thing the rest of the way down?

 

[Log Splitter]

Whatever you do, stay safe, be sure to wear a hardhat and look up a lot.

Is the hinge still intact? It almost looks like the tree has moved down into the facecut (which is a bit deep, IMO).

Do you have access to a good winch and some chain?

 

[Sprig]

In the imbedded pic you say that looks west, then you want to fall it towards the camera, is the hinge broken yet?, how feasable is it to tie to the base of the tree just above your cut and use a (relatively powerful ie 4x4) vehicle/and or winch to pull the bottom west (as it appears to be a road there)with another rope tied and anchored as high as you can get securing it to pull the top east and act as a fulcrum. I am thinking that if you can pop the bottom off towards the west and get it moving (no slow pull iow) that you'd get it moving enough that the weight of it will eventually snap off the offending snagged branches. Just a thought fer the morning.
Take great care no matter what you choose and stay safe and keep us curious ones posted on your progress!



Serge

 

[2FatGuys]

The tree is leaning west.. right? How much tree is above the snag? If there is enough to keep it from falling west once a few feet are removed from the base, then you can do a standing buck and make it fall whichever direction you want.

Read this carefully: THIS IS VERY DANGEROUOS AND SHOULD NOT BE TRIED BY ANYONE INEXPERIENCED.

Now.. go re-read that statement. And again... And again...

The point of this is that in the hands of an experienced person (ie a pro), what I see in the pictures poses no dilema. It can be easily remedied without lots of ropes and rigging and vehicles. The living tree can be a tool in the process and our good buddy, Gravity, can create the solution. A pro could buck a few feet off the bottom, which would drop toward the lean, causing the tree to stand more upright. Another chunk or two bucked off the bottom and it would naturally fall opposite it's current lean, or could be induced to fall in any other direction by the way it is notched or by pulling, as others suggested. Just keep in mind that the base is no longer firmly attached to anything.

I have to drop 4 partially fallen pines that have similar snags this weekend.

Good luck. Find someone that has done this before. It shouldn't take but a few minutes. The tree doesn't look very big at all...

 

[Log Splitter]

I think Sprig and I are on the same page. Assuming the hinge has already let go, just winch the bottom of the tree off the stump and the rest will be handled by gravity.

That by far would be the safest technique.

 

[Sprig]

I think Sprig and I are on the same page. Assuming the hinge has already let go, just winch the bottom of the tree off the stump and the rest will be handled by gravity.

That by far would be the safest technique.

Yessir, agree. I metioned an opposing higher line in case there was a question of it going too far sideways when it slides off the oak (?). It doesn't appear to be too huge a tree so even if the hinge is still sort-of in tact a decent tug should snap 'er off np. Getting in there and making more cuts just strikes me as un-necessarily unsafe therefor unwise.

 

[NYCHA FORESTER]

Find a local tree co. and bite the bullet to have them put it on the ground safely.

Afterwards you can talk about chainsaws and other really really interesting subjects.

 

[raventai]

Thanks for the replies, I have not done anything with this one yet today, I switched over to chipping up stuff wile I waited from word from the experts, thank you for the safety advise, this one has me spooked, it is not a wide tree but it is very tall, maybe 100'?, maybe 14” diameter at chest height, it was growing tall and thin trying to get light amongst all the live oaks,

If you can get a rope in the marked crotch....and tie both ends back to what you are pulling with....you can get double strength out of your rope. I personally can hit 70ft. or so but that is with a special throw bag, throw line and 20 years of practice.

That crotch looks to be the place to pull on it, I first tried throwing a hammer with clothes line tied to it, did not get far, then tried a about half pound roll of bailing wire with same clothes line, I was hoping to use the clothes line to pull up my 3/8" rope, I think I need a lighter throw rope as the 1/4" or so clothes line seams to soak up a lot of the thrown energy,

There is a saw shop in town going to go there later today and see if they have a throwing bag and line

I am actually in coastal Florida right now at some family property, the trees in my yard near Atlanta are barren right now. Hate the winters there, brown and grey trees under overcast skies, no green to be seen,

Is the hinge still intact? It almost looks like the tree has moved down into the facecut (which is a bit deep, IMO).


Do you have access to a good winch and some chain?

The hinge is still intact, in the hinge pic the hinge is about 1" wide at the camera side (south) and maybe 1/4" at the far side (north)

The notch is a bit deeper than I originally intended, I messed up the lines and had to go deep to make them meet, the tree is healthy so even though the notch was deep it held until I was well into the back cut.

My hinges were better with my old poulan, it was so slow I had a lot of time to get it right, with the new husky just touch the tree and my path is set, I need to work on that,

I have about 20' of 3/16" stainless chain (more boat anchor parts) but no winch, I do have 2x 30’ 20K pound straps that I could pull the base with.

In the imbedded pic you say that looks west, then you want to fall it towards the camera, is the hinge broken yet?, how feasable is it to tie to the base of the tree just above your cut and use a (relatively powerful ie 4x4) vehicle/and or winch to pull the bottom west (as it appears to be a road there)with another rope tied and anchored as high as you can get securing it to pull the top east and act as a fulcrum. I am thinking that if you can pop the bottom off towards the west and get it moving (no slow pull iow) that you'd get it moving enough that the weight of it will eventually snap off the offending snagged branches. Just a thought fer the morning.
Take great care no matter what you choose and stay safe and keep us curious ones posted on your progress!



Serge

Hinge is not broken yet,

I have two land cruisers here, both 4 wheel drive, neither have a winch but one has lockers and can pull like a tractor, there is a driveway nearby and I can pull to the southwest close enough to opposite of the direction I want it to fall

If pulling from the crotch does not get it should I weaken the hinge some and then try to break off at the cut and pull the base opposite? I am pretty certain that when the hinge breaks it will rotate off the Live Oak branch and fall in the right direction as it has leaned far enough.

The tree is leaning west.. right? How much tree is above the snag? If there is enough to keep it from falling west once a few feet are removed from the base, then you can do a standing buck and make it fall whichever direction you want.

Read this carefully: THIS IS VERY DANGEROUOS AND SHOULD NOT BE TRIED BY ANYONE INEXPERIENCED.

Now.. go re-read that statement. And again... And again...

The point of this is that in the hands of an experienced person (ie a pro), what I see in the pictures poses no dilema. It can be easily remedied without lots of ropes and rigging and vehicles. The living tree can be a tool in the process and our good buddy, Gravity, can create the solution. A pro could buck a few feet off the bottom, which would drop toward the lean, causing the tree to stand more upright. Another chunk or two bucked off the bottom and it would naturally fall opposite it's current lean, or could be induced to fall in any other direction by the way it is notched or by pulling, as others suggested. Just keep in mind that the base is no longer firmly attached to anything.

I have to drop 4 partially fallen pines that have similar snags this weekend.

Good luck. Find someone that has done this before. It shouldn't take but a few minutes. The tree doesn't look very big at all...

I am a reasonably experienced home owner type but no where near pro, I have had a chain saw for about 10 years but only use it a few times a year,

Tree is leaning east, towards the camera in the “looking west” pic,I’ll try to describe the snag, the crotch in Tree co’s pic: the furthest branch (western branch) is the one hung up, on that trunk there is only about 15’ of sturdy branch until it turn into top (leaves & small branches) on the main branch there is probably another 40’ of top past the snag, it is completely free and on the down side,

I have done something similar to what you are describing with smaller tree’s, that will certainly get it done but not sure I have enough experience to do that safely, the guy that runs my local saw shop showed me nasty chain saw bite scar that came from the hung tree like this, I’ll save that one for a last resort,

 

[raventai]

Find a local tree co. and bite the bullet to have them put it on the ground safely.

Afterwards you can talk about chainsaws and other really really interesting subjects.

Not going to do that, my budget is limited and I have a bunch of trees like this one to drop on this property, I need to develop the skills to safely handle problems like this on my own,

 

[bowtechmadman]

I'd probably try a $40 dollar hand operated winch as someone said already. Tie off to another tree and winch it off the base and continue till you pull it from the snag. Had similar issue this fall and after about an hour of winching it finally let loose. Probably dragged the base about 8 - 10' before she came down.

 

[Sprig]

Maybe touch the undercut a hair, very carefully to lessen the hinge a tad, hook up the 4x4, yard that critter down mon! For sure don't be leaving it there for long, from the sound of it all the proper dynamics/direction are there to get it down safely (get pics fer us pic junkies!). It looks as though the hinge is already cracking so you should be able to snap it off imho, but (read below, we ain't there). As an afterthought, if it is not dangerous, I might open that mouth a bit before lessening the hinge (ie. angle a cut about 1ft above the mouth to near the hinge, thinking being that it'll slide over the stump/ground easier, just guessing since I ain't there), 'nother thot. :monkey:


We await. Think it out, use yer imagination and be safe as possible eh!



Serge

 

[raventai]

Went into town to my local saw shop got a nice throw bag and 200' of lightweight throw line.

Unfortunately it was dark by the time I got back, dam short winter days, will start on it first thing tomorrow,

Gonna try to set a line in the crotch and pull it, if it does not pull easy that line can be my pivot for a base pull,

Sprig if I go for the truck pull I will bevel the upper part of the notch cut, looking at the hinge it makes a lot of sense, it will not have to go "uphill" that way, it seams fairly stable right now

I will get pics :camera:

Thanks guys

 

[Sprig]

We Await the results............

Pics and commentary!


(if ya gotta do the stump pull you'll at least have a bag to play with )

Give ya +1 experience learning thingy

 

[oldphart]

my .02

I had one just like that only about a 40' that snagged the neighboring tree, I waited a couple days in hopes it would fall (never did, naturally), finally cut it through and hooked up to the base with the Mighty Dodge and pulled it. Yes the base dug in as expected but MoPar power finally came to the rescue and dragged it backwards. I had it planned that if the base dug in too much that I was going to wrap my line as close to the bottom as possible and slip a larger log under the line close to the base to help lift as it was traveling. Looks like you're still attached, IMHO, it should be freed and yanked. Be careful please.

 

[Manco]

If you happen to be close to Pensacola, I could swing by and give you a hand if you don't have it down already. :greenchainsaw:

Can't tell for sure, but whatever you do, don't take a chance on hitting the transformer pole!

 

[pbtree]

Is it down yet??????

 

[raventai]

Its down

Got a rope up there, weakened the hinge with an ax, tried the pull by hand from the top, but it was good and stuck on the oak branch, it really needed to rotate to come out and I did not want to damage the live oak (it's staying) so I did not use power to pull from the top.


I tied off the upper rope to another tree to the north east from the snagged tree as a control to keep it out of the power lines, shed, transformer etc to the south,

Got out the strap and wrapped it in the direction I wanted it to rotate, lined up the land cruiser to the southwest from the tree locked the axles and pulled, first with both straps to get further away but that put me at a poor angle, broke the hinge but dug 4 holes trying to get it off the stump, shortened it to one strap and got a better angle (more to the west) and it popped right off the stump just pulling in low, no running start, right after that it came free from the oak branch above and gravity did its thing putting it right where I wanted it. very smooth and safe , :hmm3grin2orange:

As a side note after it was down I looked at the stump and found I had a lot less hinge than I thought, my back cut actually met my notch on the north side, surprising how strong a strip of wood can be, I need to work on the accuracy of my cuts.

Thanks for the help guys I would not have thought of pulling from the bottom and I now have a new tool in my arsenal of drop techniques,

Now I am going to let loose my 372 on the offending tree :chainsawguy:

 

[raventai]

ps what kind of tree is this? I think it is a sweetgum? or is it a red maple? the wood is fairly soft. see ID pic

& the holes dug

 

[Log Splitter]

Thanks for posting back, I'm glad it worked out for you!

Man! That spot was pretty tight, I could not tell from your first post that there was a power line involved, not to mention the shed. All's well that end's well, it looks like the tree landed right where it needed to go. Good job.

BTW, I never post pictures of my stumps on AS, the pros here will always critique felling techniques. If I ever have a perfect stump, I'll take a picture.

 

[Log Splitter]

ps what kind of tree is this? I think it is a sweetgum? or is it a red maple? the wood is fairly soft. see ID pic

& the holes dug

Sweetgum. Split it if you can, and burn it for firewood in 2010.