pro saws vs homeowner/farm and ect

[WadePatton]

Regardless of the tool, I always try and buy the most expensive one I can afford. You don't save any money by buying the cheaper one only to have to go out and get the expensive one later....

large man speaketh my mind.

 

[RobertN]

One thing I have not seen mentioned so far.

Even as a homeowner I lean towards a Pro type saw, because I do not want to drive some distance for wood cutting, and have a less expensive saw take a dump on me. Been there, done that.

I have worked in other businesses where the boss got inexpensive tools. Drove two hours to a job. Tool broke down at the customers. Two hour drive back. Can't find parts for broken tool. Hours later, wind up just buying another new tool. Two hour drive back, the next day... Three guys sitting waiting for tool, customer unhappy does not understand. Boss just lost a couple grand$$$, and is trying to make customer happy again. Boss is pizzed and grumpy on the two hour drive back to the shop...

As a homeowner/landowner, I may just have to wait till next weekend if the inexpensive saw does not hold up. In business though, that $200 savings up front may mean hundreds or thousands of dollars lost if the tool goes down.

I understand a Pro model can and does some times go down. But not as often. From my limited experience with chainsaws, and other tools out in the field.

Fortunately, when I had problems with a less expensive saw, I had a good saw with me. The less expensive one was just for small stuff.

I get to do some stuff others don't; getting on a fire engine and having to depend on a saw. You REALLY do not want to be on the ventilation crew when the saw won't work... Pro, or Pro/Rescue saws then. And if you mention fire, just like aircraft stuff, the price goes up right away...

 

[jd548esco72]

I look at it this way. My father has run his 029 for 14 yrs cutting over 8 cords of wood for himself and unknown amount for family members. All he does is brush off the saw and clean the air filter. He didnt start flipping his bar till I got after him last year. At the end of the firewood cutting season, he does a detailed cleaning of his. He has a few seasons left on his saw and he is happy with it.

Ive got a 455 rancher that I do not use anymore. I used for a half of a firewood season and bought a new husky 372xp. The 455 was given to me by my mother in law as a xmas gift. Nice mother in law Ive got. Day and night preformance between a pro saw and rancher/land owner saw.

Each saw has a intended end user. For a home owner that was going to cut 4-8 cords of wood a year. A husky 455 rancher or a ms-290 would be a great choice. Assuming that general maintenance is preformed on the saw, plus using a high quality mix oil and high octane gasoline. You will get alot of usage out a mid-grade saw.

Dummy me, I found this site and got a horse power bug! Now I can not stand using a mid-grade saw. I use my univent most of the time. It bugs me how slow my 455 rancher @ 3.5hp cuts slow compared to my univent @ 6.5hp.
:monkey:

so your dads 029 lasted 14 years cutting around 8 cords per year? thats great! good for him. my 029super only lasted 5 years and some months. maybe i got a Monday saw and he got a Thursday saw? his experience with the 029 is pretty good. where mine was just so-so.

on our pulpwood job a good saw hand would generally have to fell and buck about 18 cords a day. i could put in what our log job was cutting--but there wasn't as much bucking so i don't see an easy comparison to firewood getting. a good day would produce a good bit more than 18 cords.

that is how much a pro saw had to put out on the job. and there in lies the gap between the pro class of saws and homeowner saws.

a good number of the old saws we ran for years on the job when they were finally written off for tax purposes where just given to saw hands and other crew members where they cut firewood and did general use for another 10-15 years. most of these saws had nothing more than minor repairs. a clutch here, a carb kit or two--just a few had a piston or ring replacement.

one j-red 670 my dad bought new in 1983 was put in the hands of the felling crew for over three years cutting saw timber. normally three years felling saw timber is more than enough. the saw passed a compression test and check up at the shop. so it went to the bucking deck for another 4-5 years for some more very hard use. after that it ended up on the back of my skidder. where i would cut off tops and limb and so on. when my dad retired he took that saw and cut firewood for his house with it up till recent times.

so it adds up to about just under 10 years of very hard use, followed by another 10 years of hard use, followed by another 6+ years of homeowner use.

this saw hasn't ever had a ring,piston,jug,bearing,or even a seal replaced in all this time. and it still runs --but the compression is very low now and it is getting hard to start.

it has had the carb rebuilt a few times, fuel lines replaced several times , a couple clutch replacements, a couple modules over the years. seems like it had the starter replaced once IIRC.

and this is outstanding--but a number of old saws we bought have dome pretty well going well above 10+ years of very hard use. with 5 or 6 of those years being in the high production category.

a non pro saw can be a good saw--for a homeowner.

one year we needed a number of new huskys. there was some kind of shortage on the big huskys that year. our dealer knew we couldn't wait any longer so he loaned us 6 brand new white topped husky ranchers--you know the ones about the size of a J-red 630/670. i am not going to go into any details but one of them was dead after the second week. three more were having serious problems. when the new industrial husky saws came in --the only tears shed were tears of joy over the new pro saws. no body was bit sad cause the ranchers were going back to the dealer!

one thing i can say was the husky/j-red dealer we had was really good to us back in the day. wish there was folks like that in the industry still.

 

[TreeClimber57]

dont forget a few husky landowner saws fit in well with the pro saws

They do (well close - they do fit in but sort of bottom end of pro..).. as do a couple of mid-range Stihl saws.

 

[Evan]

ill go look and see what brand piston and cylinder my 359. i dont think theyre mahel, the piston is mahle but i didnt find a stamp anywhere on the cylinder, just numbers. id almost assume the cylinder is mahle to but id probly be wrong

 

[weimedog]

Have to jump in. This a statistical game. Where are the "Pro" saws have better materials? Cases sometimes, cylinder/piston?

I can say I've had good luck with both homeowner and pro saws alike and I have seen both fail.

Lousy skills will kill any saws. Good skills will make any saw last longer.

My "Homeowner" 455 and 440e have performed wonderfully for our farm with lots of hours and lots of situations. My Homeowner Homelite Ranger performed fence and trail duty for around 4 years with no issues..it just got retired by that 440e.

At work they bought 4 Husqvarna 357XP's. They all toasted their Cylinder/Barrel within two years.

So by that statistic...homeowner saws are better.


Having said that, saw like those old Stihl 026's and of similar ilk last forever. The old Pro Homelites of thirty years ago are still inservice...even here on my place.

No replacement for good materials. That coupled with good skills is the winning cmbination. My bet is the "skill" side, from both a user and maintenance point of view is the most important factor.

 

[TreeClimber57]

Lousy skills will kill any saws. Good skills will make any saw last longer.

Amen!!

Having said that, saw like those old Stihl 026's and of similar ilk last forever. The old Pro Homelites of thirty years ago are still inservice...even here on my place.

No replacement for good materials. That coupled with good skills is the winning combination. My bet is the "skill" side, from both a user and maintenance point of view is the most important factor.

So true. Which is why many will complain about homeowner saws. Typically less quality materials, or not quite as well designed, they gotta cut the cost somewhere. And why so many will say the pro saws are better.. If you have the combination you stated, many saws will last forever. If you lack one of them you are prone to more failures.. and if you lack them both.. then good luck.

 

[joecool85]

Amen!!



So true. Which is why many will complain about homeowner saws. Typically less quality materials, or not quite as well designed, they gotta cut the cost somewhere. And why so many will say the pro saws are better.. If you have the combination you stated, many saws will last forever. If you lack one of them you are prone to more failures.. and if you lack them both.. then good luck.

The latter of which is what happens to most homeowner saws.

 

[Zero Gravity]

Lots of holes in these discussions. The Husky "land owner" saws are the same materials and most parts on the saws. They only differ in the cylinder and piston. To me the same saw running at a 90% level would last longer?
I think a lot of people are making emotional decisions.
ZG

 

[REJ2]

Riddle me this-- When one replaces the P/C on a pro saw with an aftermarket kit costing 1/3 to 1/2 of what an OEM P/C costs what do have? Add to that an aftermarket crank? Answer-- a non pro--pro saw. I read more people rebuilding with aftermarket parts than OEM. If your expecting another twenty years out of your saw with half price parts then why couldnt you have done that in the first place? The pro saw being rebuildable really doesnt hold water unless you use the same quality parts which probably happens less than the aftermarket route. REJ2

 

[TreeClimber57]

I think a lot of people are making emotional decisions.

Possibly true.

Lots of holes in these discussions. The Husky "land owner" saws are the same materials and most parts on the saws. They only differ in the cylinder and piston. To me the same saw running at a 90% level would last longer?

If that is the case, why the huge cost differential.. or is there a big difference?

I know on the Stihl side, which actually has 3 levels of saws, there is a huge difference between the lowest level and the top one. Not even comparable IMHO. The bottom end saws are POS in the Stihl lineup, and frankly do not deserve to wear the brand. I have had a few over the years, still do.. why? Heaven only knows.. I own a 170 that had had 3 carburetors in the first 4 months of its life. Every time you took it out, it needed a new carburetor. I only bought it for the hunt camp.. but wish I had picked up a 200.. does not have one hour use on it to this day.

Now between the mid-range and pro there is much less difference, although there is still difference in bulk, weight, ease of servicing, etc.. As far as longevity, the mid-range Stihl will last. (but there is still a 25% difference in cost).

I must admit that I have limited knowledge on the Husqvarna side, with only two saws. I have never had any experience with their non-pro lineup. (I do also use a Husqvarna rifle to hunt with - never tried to cut trees with it though)

 

[Zero Gravity]

Possibly true.



If that is the case, why the huge cost differential.. or is there a big difference?

I know on the Stihl side, which actually has 3 levels of saws, there is a huge difference between the lowest level and the top one. Not even comparable IMHO. The bottom end saws are POS in the Stihl lineup, and frankly do not deserve to wear the brand. I have had a few over the years, still do.. why? Heaven only knows.. I own a 170 that had had 3 carburetors in the first 4 months of its life. Every time you took it out, it needed a new carburetor. I only bought it for the hunt camp.. but wish I had picked up a 200.. does not have one hour use on it to this day.

Now between the mid-range and pro there is much less difference, although there is still difference in bulk, weight, ease of servicing, etc.. As far as longevity, the mid-range Stihl will last. (but there is still a 25% difference in cost).

I must admit that I have limited knowledge on the Husqvarna side, with only two saws. I have never had any experience with their non-pro lineup. (I do also use a Husqvarna rifle to hunt with - never tried to cut trees with it though)

Very good points. I believe they are accurate too. On the Husky land owner line there is not a big difference in price. This probaly means they are a good saw. My experience with them also indicate this. The land owner saws responds well to the common mods, which bring them very close to the pro performance levels All in all very good for consumer.
ZG

 

[rarefish383]

I jumped from the first page to here and didn't read all the input in the middle. I just came in from cutting down 2, 24" Oaks, that have been standing dead for 2 or 3 years. They were my secret stash of fire wood. I used one of my Homelite 1050's. One was bought in 1972 and the other in 73.They were both used comercially untill about 3 or 4 years ago when one quit running. I kept the other one running for another year or so by swapping off parts from the first one. Since I retired I didn't need a big saw so I put them up in the shed. A few months ago I decided to try and get at least one of them running. That's how I found this site. Mostly for sentmental reasons and to try milling if I did get them going again. From the encouragement of others on this site I took apart the saw with good compression and put a NOVA II ignition in itm and I am a happy camper. Now the 1050 with the 3' bar didn't get used as much as the one with the 2' bar, and that didn't get used as much as the smaller saws. but they did get hard use for the best part of 30 years. I killed at least six or 8 Wood Sharks and Wild Things before I broke down and bought the Farm Boss I use as my small ground saw. I use a little Echo 305 for climbing, of which I do very little of any more. If I ever buy an other new saw it will be a pro. If I live long enough to have grand kids it will probably still be running, Joe.

 

[smilin possum]

Riddle me this-- When one replaces the P/C on a pro saw with an aftermarket kit costing 1/3 to 1/2 of what an OEM P/C costs what do have? Add to that an aftermarket crank? Answer-- a non pro--pro saw. I read more people rebuilding with aftermarket parts than OEM. If your expecting another twenty years out of your saw with half price parts then why couldnt you have done that in the first place? The pro saw being rebuildable really doesnt hold water unless you use the same quality parts which probably happens less than the aftermarket route. REJ2

Good point. Example, 044 Stihl and a 262 pro Husky both on the logging crew for 10 yrs. Husky gave up the ghost let the shop guys tell me the after market stuff was as good as OEM. Went that way- 2 months later dead again. This time all OEM still going strong.

044 10 yrs. logging, 10 more on the firewood truck, NEVER have done a thing to this saw but take care of it and replace the regular stuff. Fuel lines, bars & chains, carb rebuilds. This old mule may be the exception to the rule but what is there to complain about it has paid for itself many times over.

We have an old 028wb that has been in the family for 34 yrs. this year. I had to put piston and rings in it because of years of use. Spent $100 and hope my boy gets 30 yrs. out of it. It's going to out live me. With all this said I can not complain. These saws are still going strong as ever, 2 are I guess pro models and 1 is not. But they keep on making $$$$$ the bottom line.
Saw Safe
Joe

 

[ShoerFast]

a question for the saw folks

in another thread a sort of friendly argument arose over how good a certain non pro type of saw is.

the argument was that the non pro saw was just as good as the pro counterpart with the advantage that it costs $100 to $200 less.

my experience with that saw was that it was just OK enough for moderate use and it didn't last anywhere near as long as it's pro class brothers.

additional info- this is what you the experienced saw man thinks is best.

we all know the story about greenhorn super gomers straight gassing a new 660. this poll ain't about what you would hand greenhorn the super gomer on the job. this is what you would rather have.

Just a couple thoughts....

*If you can't afford a real saw when you buy a box-store excuse, you sure will not be able to afford a real saw when it craps out on you. (Wildthinggies)

*If you need to sell it, you will get a higher return on investment from a real saw.

*If your going to use it hard, expect to get out what you paid for it.

My used 310 paid for my new 361, no one would reach over a 361 for a 290/310/390 saw.

 

[dq72]

Pro saw all the way for me now. If it's kept maintained like it should I beileve most all saws will serve you well. I had a Poulan Wood Shark 14'' bought new in 1995 and let me tell you, I cut 15-20 ricks of wood with it every winter up until 3yrs ago, I sold it to a relative who cuts about 10 ricks/year with it now. It's never missed a beat. I always kept it tuned up but I also believe one of the biggest things is to use high quality oils. I run Amsoil 100:1 and Amsoil bar oil. Only reason I sold that poulan is I wanted a Stihl. Now 3yrs later- I own 5 Stihls. Sometimes I wish I still had that poulan just to see how much longer it would last me.

 

[chad3]

Could be wrong, but...
I had a breather issue with my 361, took one pop and dropped a new breather in. From what some have said it is no where near as easy with the mid range saws. They seem quicker to fix in the small every day stuff than others.
Is this others take? Other than the fact that they have less plastic etc.
Chad

 

[TreeClimber57]

Could be wrong, but...
I had a breather issue with my 361, took one pop and dropped a new breather in. From what some have said it is no where near as easy with the mid range saws. They seem quicker to fix in the small every day stuff than others.
Is this others take? Other than the fact that they have less plastic etc.
Chad

Mid-Range are not quite as easy.. the low end ones are terrible. (although they do at times tend to fall apart.. so if they happen to fall open when you want to work on them.. maybe is ok -- then can also be a pain to get closed)

 

[rob066]

The order is placed, pro saw for me please. I cut on the average of 60 face chords of firewood a year. That is alot of repetitive cuts in a year times x amount of years. I also use my saws for other chores.

 

[chucker]

the "PRO" to go! and then again any saw over 3.8 is classed as a proffesional saw... this is why the smaller saws are sold with the safty chain (for weekend users and home use) .