The 50:1 2 Cycle Oil Myth ? "epa"

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No one wants there saws to emplode on themself after some of the recommend sergery youll find here. Tune ing the saw & knowing where your rpms are the first step. Getting the saw to really stand up & bark is another . Lean seasures is what I have mostly seen come thru the local dealer. Lean miss causes hc & detonation levels to go up. Your doing more for the enviroment by richening it up because now your at the optimum burn ratio & max hp is at it s best. Its very simple if you want optima then youll need optima.
 
I don't believe that stihl,or husky or any saw manufacturer makes their own oil.They may have it made to their specs,but any name brand oil is probably as good as the next.Stihl or husky wants you to buy their oil thats good for business.Just had one of the top saw builders,port and modify my 7900 he told me to go 32 to 1 with any good oil.He also said that using high test gas was better then regular.Look at it like this if you are comfortable running 100 or 50 to one thats your business.I believe you are safer at 40 to 1 but you are really safe at 32 to 1.You might foul a 3 dollar plug but thats a lot cheaper then an overhaul.
 
I've been running my oil 50:1 in my dirt bikes - chainsaws - weedeaters for a long time with no problems and will continue to do so. My 17 year old Husky 50 has had a steady diet of 50:1 since it was bought new in 1990 - it still has good compression and runs great. How can you argue with that? Matt
 
sawinredneck said:
The way his has always been explained:

The older oils were not as good as what we have available nowso you needed more of it to do the job. I have been running synthetics at 50:1 and have had my saws apart several times, they look like new inside. I don't see any need to change a thing I am doing, the pistons are nice and slick, the canks have a nice film on them etc..
Now, if the gas keps going downhill as it has been, and has been mentioned by another poster, I may be forced to change!
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You win the gold medal this time also - my ol' 1970 Jonserds 621 "calls for" 25:1, but has been run on 50:1 as long as anyone remember - it is still going strong, and didn't like 25:1 at all, the single time I tried it - ran crappy and lots of smoke......
 
Why is oil mix such a popular topic?

Because there has yet to be a definitive answer on the subject, none of the answers people give on this site, are backed by hard scientific data.

I run my saws on synthetic oil mixed at 32:1 and it works fine for me. I don't have any carbon problems or plug fouling, and the extra oil keeps the seals nice and wet.
 
I'am not arguing with any body,Your choice is yours,My choice is mine.If you feel good at 50to1 great.My personal choice is 32to1.Been running saws since I was 16 then it was 16to1. That was almost 44 years ago.At one time I had several saws,trimmers,and lawn boys that all called for different mix.Rather then having several cans just found it easier to run 32to1 in one can.after doing this for over 20 years no problem.If I get a little bit of smoke no problem just brings back memories of running those big old macs and Remington mauls.
 
wampum said:
I'am not arguing with any body,Your choice is yours,My choice is mine.If you feel good at 50to1 great.My personal choice is 32to1.Been running saws since I was 16 then it was 16to1. That was almost 44 years ago.At one time I had several saws,trimmers,and lawn boys that all called for different mix.Rather then having several cans just found it easier to run 32to1 in one can.after doing this for over 20 years no problem.If I get a little bit of smoke no problem just brings back memories of running those big old macs and Remington mauls.
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Do you ever look at your exhaust port?
 
oil

Has anybody actually seen an failure caused by 50 to 1 mix?
In 26 years of saw repair and maintenance, I have not. Lean seize explains itself, caused by lean mixture adjustment, not oil mixture. I have seen failures due to bad oil in the early 80s,failures due to dirt ingestion, contaminated fuel, old fuel and lack of maintenance.

I have seen 32 to 1 oil mixed 50 to 1, and eventually piston scuffing occurred.

IMHO, I believe the mix ratio could safely be much higher with quality synthetic oils.

It is the oil, not the saw.

There, I have now done my part for this thread.:deadhorse:
 
Mike Maas said:
You've never seen a saw get a lot of hours and lose compression? Never seen a piston skirt wear thin and get sloppy, maybe even break off?
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You're implying that anytime a piston skirt wears and gets sloppy or a saw loses compression it is the fault of oil ratio. That does not follow.
 
I run 40:1 in all my weed wackers, chainsaws and anything that is 2 stroke. The only exception is my 78 honda express moped, I run that on 32:1 because my carb is tempermental and sometimes it gets on the lean side of things. That and I run it at WOT for hours on end with no letting up, at least a saw gets some idle time lol.
 
edgeandengine said:
Do you ever look at your exhaust port?
Click to expand...

I run 25 to1 . Carbon build up has not been a problem nor smoke. The people I work for use 50 to 1. There is a little differance in exhaust I am sure but I only seem to notice any significant smoke at start up after choking the saws. On small jobs sometimes the chipper stays home and we mulch the brush down after throwing it on the truck with saws inside the truckbed. Some of the exhaust will hang in the bed depending on wind conditions and I have noticed no difference between his saws and mine there. I do believe my saws are usually finer tuned and a saw being ran with a dirty air cleaner or improper fuel to air ratio due to carb adjustment is far more responsible for the carbon build up then a higher oil mix ratio.
I raced motocross a couple years using 16 to 1 in a kx 250 and yz 125. A lot of them were going to 40 or 50 to 1 then, and it sounded to me it was standard procedure for most of them to rering every 2 or 3 races. I would race all year before tearing my engine down and still be pushing excellant compression.
I understand we have much better oil these days which is a good thing and I am aware the 50 to 1 is sufficient to do the job most of the time. I am also confident todays oil burns cleaner no matter which ratio you use so that is good for me to. Oil reduces friction which only helps provided your engine is tuned to burn it efficiently. It also increases compression which is an asset for maximum power in most cases. I accidently put staight gas in my old 034 when it was about 3 yrs old and it locked up. I got it free out in the woods and ran it for a bout 7 years on 25 to 1, sold it to a tree guy who used 50 to 1, and I think it made it less then 1 yr on 50 t0 1. I run my saws for longer sessions doing firewood and it appears to me my saws are lasting significantly longer then the 50 to 1 tree trimmers. As a matter of fact I do not remember wearing out my saws in 25 years of selling firewood. I get a lot of saws for parts or fix up low on compression or seized usually from lack of oil.
 
stihltech said:
Has anybody actually seen an failure caused by 50 to 1 mix?
In 26 years of saw repair and maintenance, I have not. Lean seize explains itself, caused by lean mixture adjustment, not oil mixture. I have seen failures due to bad oil in the early 80s,failures due to dirt ingestion, contaminated fuel, old fuel and lack of maintenance.

I have seen 32 to 1 oil mixed 50 to 1, and eventually piston scuffing occurred.

IMHO, I believe the mix ratio could safely be much higher with quality synthetic oils.

It is the oil, not the saw.

There, I have now done my part for this thread.:deadhorse:
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:chainsaw: :cheers: Exactullly . You have to look closely at the molicule structure of synthetich it is far superior to conventional oil in that there are more of them & closer togather. As has been suggested by people in the know when milling 40:1 using ultra . The saws I just built will be getting set at 800 rpm over max .90 gal of premimum fuel & the ultra . Thats after break in at 12k. With 8 & 9 rim sprockets any saw can be made to rip.
 
No problem with the exhaust port,no problems at all, they just run and run and run.Most dealers want you to go 50to1.There my saws I'll run them The way I want and I will continue to run them 32to1.Sold saws for years I know the line the dealer knows best,he is the expert you are the dummy.This is not always the case.My brother took his husky to the local stihl dealer after I went out of business he told him that it was blown up.I asked him before he traded it to let me check it, the plug was fouled.Hes still running that saw 8 years later.The dealer was going to give him peanuts for the saw,and sell him a new stihl and make a bunch.Wonder what he was going to do with a husky in great shape?You don't think he would have sold it do you?over the years I found at least 3 other saws that same dealer said was shot only to find minor problems with them.Reality is that not all dealers are good guys, most are, but there are bad apples. I have one dealer I get parts from he is a totally honest man I have dealt with him for 40 years he is in his late 70's I have great respect for him he wouldn't cheat me and I wouldn't cheat him.Over the years he has become a good friend.He knows that I repair my own saws and at times offers me good advice. I will miss him when he retires.
 
wampum said:
No problem with the exhaust port,no problems at all, they just run and run and run.Most dealers want you to go 50to1.There my saws I'll run them The way I want and I will continue to run them 32to1.Sold saws for years I know the line the dealer knows best,he is the expert you are the dummy.This is not always the case.My brother took his husky to the local stihl dealer after I went out of business he told him that it was blown up.I asked him before he traded it to let me check it, the plug was fouled.Hes still running that saw 8 years later.The dealer was going to give him peanuts for the saw,and sell him a new stihl and make a bunch.Wonder what he was going to do with a husky in great shape?You don't think he would have sold it do you?over the years I found at least 3 other saws that same dealer said was shot only to find minor problems with them.Reality is that not all dealers are good guys, most are, but there are bad apples. I have one dealer I get parts from he is a totally honest man I have dealt with him for 40 years he is in his late 70's I have great respect for him he wouldn't cheat me and I wouldn't cheat him.Over the years he has become a good friend.He knows that I repair my own saws and at times offers me good advice. I will miss him when he retires.
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That all sounds right by me.
I bought a nice looking 026 pro along with a scruffy o25 for $50 about 2 years ago. I know the guy , a tree trimmer said the stihl dealer told him it needed the top end rebuilt on the 026. It had good compression and looked ok through the exthaust port and I got it to start. sounded like a fuel delivery problem so I took the carb apart and decided to put a new fuel line on it as it looked short. It had the wrong line on it and aside of cleaning the carb I put on a bar and chain and used it for about a year and then sold it here locally for $275.
We used to have a real good saw mechanic about 25 miles from here, but he went to a goverment job. The closest one is the one that looked at that 026 which is a fairly typical of his evaluations. Most of the others within 5o miles I don't know well or they are fairly new to the trade.
 
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