To MOD or Not To MOD?

[livewire]

I am seeking input from all of you guys.

I'm terribly conflicted whether or not to modify my 361. I don't race at all and I'm not a logger or arborist either.

I've seen a few guys here that have modded their saws and seem satisfied with the end results but can the "average cord-cutter" be justified spending money to modify an already exceptional saw beyond a decent muffler mod?

What are the risks and benefits? Is anyone else out there a cord-cutter that like me is considering a modded saw?

I cut alot of wood, most of which I keep myself while some gets sold off.

Please advise me as I would love hear all your opinions and I definately need to shoot either the devil or angel on my shoulder!!!

Thanks in advance!

 

[GASoline71]

I know that the gains I got from the muffler mod alone, are fantastic. I wouldn't even consider modding it further. Personally I wouldn't mod my saw other than what I have done so far. But...what works good for me might not be enough for you.

Gary

 

[1953greg]

at least do/have the muff modded
cylinder mods get personal. if u need/want the extra power, by all means

benifits:10-30% more power (depending on mods) and a cooler running saw
risks: only to your wallet. u wil eventually understand what i mean

shoot the devil go for it!!!!

 

[computeruser]

I've seen a few guys here that have modded their saws and seem satisfied with the end results but can the "average cord-cutter" be justified spending money to modify an already exceptional saw beyond a decent muffler mod?

A good muffler mod should do most users just fine. Keep the saw properly tuned and your loops sharp and you'll be a happy cutter.

What are the risks and benefits? Is anyone else out there a cord-cutter that like me is considering a modded saw?

Risks include a botched p/c porting job, which may or may not be something that the saw builder is willing to eat 100% of the cost of, especially where the replacement piston/cylinder costs as much as the porting job. In terms of the saw's overall longevity, a mild porting job on a working saw should not diminish its overall life expectancy. The benefits, obviously, come in having a more powerful saw in a lighter package.

For a guy who just wants to go out and cut wood, I'd stick with the muffler mod and save the few hundred dollars in porting work to put towards something else. If cutting is something you do for a living or you have to pack your saw around on your shoulder all day long, then it is probably worth it for you to maximize the power-to-weight ratio of your saws. And, of course, if you want a saw to race or just want to have the satisfaction of owning a modded saw, then your choice is obvious.

If your overall goal is to cut faster, spend your time and energy on your chains. There is more gain to be had in a well-sharpened chain than most people realize. This past summer at our GTG in Frederic, MI, I ran my muffler modded 7900 with new off the roll round-ground Carlton chain back-to-back with Rick Helsel's stock 7900 with square-ground work chain. I forget the numbers (you can find them under the Michigan Mini-GTG post), but I want to say that his stock saw was cutting 1.5x as fast as mine simply on account of the chain. And you don't even have to go to square-ground chain to see a noticeable improvement - I gained a 20% cutting speed improvement on my 066 just by removing a little bit of material off the backside of the cutters.

 

[IchWarriorMkII]

I've thought about modding my 361, already, on the stand point of it running cooler, with more power. I like how it runs now, so Im going to run it for a while and see if I find myself wanting a little more power... if I do I might go ahead and mod it up.

I also think, I could just leave it stock, get a slightly larger saw (used maybe) and get it modded up to be my big saw, and leave my 353 and 361 stock. We'll see... my feelings towards fiddling with stuff change back and forth over time. Over all though, I think my stock 361 runs fine and I'd rather spend my money on chains and keeping them sharp.

 

[Lakeside53]

I'm with Computeruser... and a few others - just the muffler... but it's a fine saw even if you don't.

 

[Canyon Angler]

I don't know enough about saw mods to comment, other than to make these 2 points:

1) If your saw is still under warranty, and you mod it, and something goes wrong with the saw, your dealer may not honor the warranty -- even if the problem wasn't your fault. That alone is enough to convince me to wait until my saw is a year old before modding the muffler.

2) It's been pointed out lots of times on the site, but just in case you don't know: When you open up the muffler, it tends to make the saw run leaner which can make the saw seize. So, after you open up the muffler, you'll need to re-tune the carb to make the fuel mix richer. There's lots here on the site on how to do it.

You probably know all this already, I just wanted to throw it out in case you didn't. Good luck.

 

[livewire]

Computeruser, The words "botched" and "...eat 100%" are huge to me!

incoming rep!

 

[B_Turner]

I am in a small minority here, but I personally don't even muffler mod my saws because I don't like the extra noise. Not a popular position, but I make up for any performance gains by having really sharp chains. The times I've run against muffler modded saws (same saw) in bigger wood (which I usually am cutting) I've come out on top due to my chains.

In fact, I may be in a minority of one...

But for some the sound is part of the fun, and I don't have a problem with that. It just isn't for me as I do alot of big and fairly sustained cuts.

So do whatever you enjoy the best.

 

[Lakeside53]

I
In fact, I may be in a minority of one...

Not so.. just "ONE" that will admit to it on AS:biggrinbounce2:

 

[Mr.]

I like full up mods. NOT LOUD MUFFLERS.

Too much fun.

Fred

 

[livewire]

Thanks for the responses.

I don't necessarily need to be "told" what to do. In contrast, I'm looking for as much valid input as possible so I can make an educated, thought out decision.

You guys are great and I have the utmost respect for your experience and input!

 

[rahtreelimbs]

IMO..........all that modding a saw does is give me the shats and giggles. I am a performance junky thru and thru............these are my only reasons!!!:biggrinbounce2:


I will add that good maintenance is a must with a modded saw.

Run with a dirty filter and a dull chain and the gains are moot!!!

 

[CaseyForrest]

I dont race, heck, I dont even have allot of wood to cut. I did just get my 361 worked over by a member here because I just wanted to see what a modded saw was all about. It really comes down to whether or not you want to put the extra $200-$300 into an otherwise already awesome saw. The 361 is hands down a great saw stock...do something with the muffler and it gets better. Let a builder get their hands on it and it gets even better.

That being said, computeruser is right, youd crap yourself seeing firsthand the improvements that can be had taking the time to keep your chains straight. Id say take the money youd use to mod it and buy yourself a grinder...

 

[livewire]

...youd crap yourself seeing firsthand the improvements that can be had taking the time to keep your chains straight. Id say take the money youd use to mod it and buy yourself a grinder...

Ya, you guys are starting to wear on me regarding grinders. I do alright handfiling but it'd be nice to eliminate the need to pay someone else! That research is underway as well!

Thanks CF

 

[rahtreelimbs]

One thing about modding a saw is that no one has a gun to your head!

Take your time...........let the saw break in and mod the muffler..........the decide!!!

You may find that the novalty has worn off or the saw is good enough!



Of course this never worked for me!!!:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[THALL10326]

I am in a small minority here, but I personally don't even muffler mod my saws because I don't like the extra noise. Not a popular position, but I make up for any performance gains by having really sharp chains. The times I've run against muffler modded saws (same saw) in bigger wood (which I usually am cutting) I've come out on top due to my chains.

In fact, I may be in a minority of one...

But for some the sound is part of the fun, and I don't have a problem with that. It just isn't for me as I do alot of big and fairly sustained cuts.

So do whatever you enjoy the best.

I'll second that post, include me in your group. I have no modded saws, no modded mufflers and I've yet to have a tree escape. Sharp chains are a must. I usually cut by myself so I don't worry about a hot rod saw showing up in the woods to give me a spanking. Even if one did show up and spank my stock saw I'd lie about it like everyone else does,:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:

This thing about modding is interesting though, very interesting indeed....

 

[livewire]

I'll second that post, include me in your group. I have no modded saws, no modded mufflers and I've yet to have a tree escape. Sharp chains are a must. I usually cut by myself so I don't worry about a hot rod saw showing up in the woods to give me a spanking. Even if one did show up and spank my stock saw I'd lie about it like everyone else does,:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:

This thing about modding is interesting though, very interesting indeed....

Roger that!
Sharp chain = reduced fatigue, faster cuts, happier saw and sawyer!!!

 

[B_Turner]

IMO..........all that modding a saw does is give me the shats and giggles. I am a performance junky thru and thru.

Ah, but I love maybe 20percent performance gain across all 12 saws and all those I'll have for the rest of my life. I got heat for preaching it in an earlier thread, but I love the performance thrill of fresh square ground chain and to me anything else is no fun. My 7900 stock with fresh square is fearsome. And when running a 36 or 42 inch bar with my 066 or 395 they practically cut (well almost) like the next sized saw. I've said it before and I'll say it again, anyone that has never run fresh ground square chain (not just out of a box) you absolutely don't know what you're missing.


I do run semi chisel when I have to, but don't enjoy it.

Long live the Pro Sharp.


I promised to send Ben a randomly selected square chain from my chain drawer to try, but the power outage and such got me distracted. I will get around to that soon.

 

[windthrown]

361 mods

I know that the gains I got from the muffler mod alone, are fantastic. I wouldn't even consider modding it further. Personally I wouldn't mod my saw other than what I have done so far. But...what works good for me might not be enough for you.

Gary

<snippette>

Buick 215 c.i. V-8 Hotsaw

Good advice. I am considering muff mods on our MS 290 and my 'soon to be in my hands' MS 361. Yah, I made the dive and plunged into getting a 361. I blame AS completely for this saw purchase. I also cut 8-10 cords of firewood a year and clear 105 acres of windtrown trees and do a lot of Rx thinning around here. And the 290 takes my hand off when starting w/o a decomp start button (was looking at the 390 but was talked into the 361 here on AS).

Y'all got a photo of that thar Buick hot saw by any chance? And does it have more than a muffler mod? :hmm3grin2orange: