why blakes over taut line?

[John Paul Sanborn]

if going to a closed loop tress knot, start with a distal or swabish 3:1, much easier to use. I've been trying MT/VT and am not really happy. I heard that in drop testing they will hold for the first bounce then open, dropping the test load.

I've also found Tenex to be too heat sensative for me to use. I did not bale out of a tree once and in less then 3 months I have at least one full strand severed. I'll be using ultratech from now on. Leave the tenex for rigging and adjustable MTIP

Justin, I think your knot may be overkill. My understanding of the friction dynamics is that most of the load is taken by the upper wraps, hence the reason for the 3:1 in the distal and swabish.

 

[Stumper]

"Justin, I think your knot may be overkill."
JPS, You may be right,but it handles well-and I trust it.

 

[Dave]

Hate to just delete these without posting them somewhere, this sems like as good a thread as any.

 

[Dave]

view from the udder side

 

[kf_tree]

those short tails look a little scarey to me, plus i would not not use auto locks. any thing that locks automaticly can unlock automaticly, i don't trust auto locks. screw gates are the only biners i use.

 

[Dave]

I thought the same thing when I posted the pics, I think it's the $60.00 walmart camera, but I'm going to :Eye: :Eye: them in the morning. Never had any trouble with the Petzl William 'biners, but then I don't climb in ice storms. Had a Kong grenade grip? that would stick unlocked, didn't like that.

 

[kf_tree]

just i little tid bit of info. the thumb print on the william ball lock is the thumb print of the guy that designed the biner.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Yo!

File this in the "For-What It's-Worth" column.

If you fall under the watch of ANSI regulations, scrrew gater biners don't pass section 3.7 of the Z-133 standard.

While I was in Seattle I had a good, long talk with Graeme McMahon about screw vs. autolock. Neither of them exempt the climber from constant inspection.

Autolocks have a good working history in arboriculture though. Screw gates don't. By your logic, anything that can be screwed manually can be unscrewed by accident. I won't let anyone on my team climb with screw gates.

Tom

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Yo!

File this in the "For-What It's-Worth" column.

If you fall under the watch of ANSI regulations, scrrew gater biners don't pass section 3.7 of the Z-133 standard.

While I was in Seattle I had a good, long talk with Graeme McMahon about screw vs. autolock. Neither of them exempt the climber from constant inspection.

Autolocks have a good working history in arboriculture though. Screw gates don't. By your logic, anything that can be screwed manually can be unscrewed by accident. I won't let anyone on my team climb with screw gates.

The tails on the FP are way too short! Besides, the cord is starting to unravel. After the double fishermans' is dressed you should stitch or at a minimum tape the ends for security purposes. Just becaues you never have had a problem doesn't mean they won't suck through. Have you followed the discussion on this thread about the way that the tautline rolls out without a stopper? The same action can take place here.

Tom

 

[Rob Murphy]

Ive noticed that the fishermans knot on Spectra speed 8mm prussick , on which I tape the ends has been working lose.
I have now taken to stiching them....

 

[murphy4trees]

How do you cut and finish the ends of the ultrtech. Also are lengths different for french prussic and the distal/swabish. Also how do you know when the ultratch is ready to be retired?
Thanks and anything else you would like to share will be appreciated.
God Bless All,
Daniel

 

[Rob Murphy]

D.... Murph...
Ultra tech yukk....it just puckers to much ....to do with the loose weave.Cut ends with really sharpe(scott) sicissors.Lenghts detirmined by expirement ,my version of fp will also make a distal or swabish on yhe same lenght.Retire when you burn through the outer weave of Ultratech....easy to do...

 

[Stumper]

Mr. Dunlap, Just curious, I thought the 'standard' defined double locking as requiring 2 separate motions to open. Why don't screwgates pass? Lots of recreational climbers (Rock et al) use 2 non locking biners reversed and opposed. That would seem very safe though not technically in accord with the Z. I'm old fashioned enough to still prefer double locking steel snaps but I was about to start using a screwlock and experiment with some of the variations of the Prusik. Please advise about the biners.

 

[rbtree]

stumper,

A true double locking biner requires three motions to open. E.g., most doubles require a lateral movement of the gate before a twist. single lockers only require a twist before opening the gate. With the Petzl ball lockers, it is: push button, twist, open.

 

[murphy4trees]

Rob,
I Am wondering if the "puckering" has to do with the way the ends are finished. Would melting ends help keep it from puckering ?
Word is Tenex will melt too low to use for the FP. What else do you use?
God Bless All,
Daniel

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Blue Streak is a Sampson product, Sherrill has some prorietary colors. Other companies have tehier colors too.

I've climbed on HyVee for years without a problem, used the white and the blue stuff in the line too. No problems with the product till this last hank I bought. I'll say more on it after i hear back form the vendor.


BTW, Fresco is selling a red, white and blue XTC-called XTC-USA

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

i go with button-lox on lifeline stuff; as pre-scribed.

2 non-lox used to be eqauted with 1 screwgate etc. (as far as safety goes; with opposing gates in mountain stuff; don't think in rescue too much though. In most areas those are infrequent use.

In rigging i use screwgates, for single use. If hanging a pulley for redirect (multi-use without checking connections), i will use a more sophisticated 'biner; or 2 opposing screwgates in pair-allel(not series); also for peace of mind, i will schedule them so that the screwlox close down. Quietly calculating that they are less likely to open by screwing themselves up hill!

There are too many incedences of screw-lox opening up by rope (or something else) turning the lock open in use. This has proven to be a deadly strategy; try it too many times and you might be able to ask those persons, personally.

 

[kf_tree]

there is alot to know about biners and there proper use. the reason i prefer screw gates is i've had auto locks OPEN on me twice. both times my life depended on the hinge point of an open gate, probably its weakest point when in the open position. i've also ice climbed with 2 seperate guides , when i went to belay them with an auto lock they took it away from me and handed me a screw gate. my auto locks are now used for hold downs in my pick up. if a screw gate opens because a rope ran across it , then it was used improperly. auto locks when used with a fig 8 are notorious for opening up in the rock and ice world. i have not heard any thing bad about the william ball locks. and auto locks do serve a purpose. there mainly used when jumaring up a fixed line and clipping off stopper knots. hey i could be wrong. but any thing that your life depends on is worth researching for its proper use and limitations. did you know omega biners are made by inmates in WA. not that i'm against that , most other biners are made over seas, so whats the difference. i just found out one my ice tools which i climbed with about 30 times is being recalled because some of that lot # had the heads popping off. even after you own and learn its proper use its worth it to check the manufacture's web site for recalls and saftey warnings. i think maybe ansi does not approve of screw gates because they are not as idiot proof as auto locks. on the big commercial mountaineering class's most of them ask the students to bring auto locks. the big reason is the guides do not have the time to go around and check to see if every one's biners are locked.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Does anyone else think it's odd that if a screw lock opens, it's because it's being use incorrectly, but if a double auto locking biner(the ones ANSI requires we use) opens, then it's the biner!

Having used both, I can say without a doubt, the screw lock is much more likely to open unintentionally.


Can-Do,
Blue Streak is a great rope, buy it with confidence. Of all the ropes I've used it's among the best. Another favorite is XTC.

 

[Dave]

Looked at the fp in the daylight today, tails are about 3/4" long. the cord came from Sherrill's, they dipped the ends in something that was supposed to keep them from ravelling, didn't work very well but did blob up the ends so I don't think they could ever pull through. Also, being a fisherman's knot the working end and tail come out together, opposite of the construction of a tautline. Bottom line- I'm comfortable with it, but if any of you guys are worried about me, Christmas isn't that far off and a cord with spliced eyes would be real nice.