Check this out. It's news to me.
Falling pics 11/25/09
- Thread starter Burvol
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paccity
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back in the mid 80's i cut a crap load of beetle kill lodgepole pine in central oregon ,allmost got sick of it.lol.can't remember the name of the bug, but would get under the bark kill it and move on to the next tree, was one of the last logging job's i had for twenty years, but it was a good forestry contract when things were slow on the west side.
under the bark = cambium = easy nutrition
bugs are lazy
bugs are lazy
paccity
Addicted to ArboristSite
sounds like you know a thing or two about forest health, some thing i sould have done when i had to stop cutting for a living. i prob would have happier than working in doors up till a few years ago.
I pretend to on TV, anyway!
newsawtooth
ArboristSite Operative
The diminished vigor of the tree as you describe makes makes me inclined to believe they are Mountain Pine Beetles. And the accompanying holes the work of some enterprising birds. Are the Mountain Pine Beetles epidemic or endemic where you were cutting? There are some indications that they are even attacking spruce here, (Colorado) in areas of high beetle activity. Nice cutting there.
Also, just wondering if anyone else notices a difference in falling beetle infested trees as opposed to healthy trees? They seem to act a little differently off the stump especially in regard to holding wood manipulation. Perhaps because they are functionally dead trees/boles with live limb weight (before they turn red)? Just spit-balling.
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My experience says that red DF snags cut the same as live trees, more or less, but as soon as the needles fall, it's a totally different beast. Sometimes they're hard and brittle, sometimes soft and punky. You have to sound 'em to tell the difference. Note that the major agents of mortality in my corner of Western WA are all fungal -- beetles are primarily opportunivores here. It's not the same even fifty miles east of here.
newsawtooth
ArboristSite Operative
I am not sure which side of the fungal debate I am on here. Clearly the fungus contributes to the decline of the tree but is it to a lesser or greater extent than severing the cambium? Have the beetles evolved to use the fungus in a way that disrupts the tree's defenses or is just chance?
The trees that surprise me sometimes are the ones that appear healthy to the casual observer. Removal of a patch of bark near a bore hole reveals galleries and blue stain. The live green limb weight is still on the trees and the stump acts a little strange. It could be related to the particular specimens which are Ponderosa no more than 60 ft tall with significant gnarled limbs. Or it could very well be the feller. Thanks for the insight, Madhatte.
The trees that surprise me sometimes are the ones that appear healthy to the casual observer. Removal of a patch of bark near a bore hole reveals galleries and blue stain. The live green limb weight is still on the trees and the stump acts a little strange. It could be related to the particular specimens which are Ponderosa no more than 60 ft tall with significant gnarled limbs. Or it could very well be the feller. Thanks for the insight, Madhatte.
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paccity
Addicted to ArboristSite
most of the lodgepole i cut were still green needle or brown, no real diff. the rotten ones took a little more concentration. we took every thing accept pondarosa, some lumber , firewood or burned. don't know how they deal with it now but then they just took everything and replant.
paccity
Addicted to ArboristSite
oh yea, i hated the dam pummy dust. hell on the teeth.
Near as I can figure, the fungus is just hitching a ride. The bugs are the real pathogen... but only when their galleries girdle the tree by severing cambium below the bark a full 360 degrees around the stem. That's how you can have a "healthy" individual within a bug-killed patch, and a blue-stained individual within a healthy patch. This is currently considered a "good" thing, as it contributes to a "mosaic" effect within forested stands regarding age, health, and species.
See all those quotes? That's the stuff I'm not sure I agree with.
hammerlogging
Addicted to ArboristSite
thats it... i have to take my ####in camera to the woods and get some pictures of some timber ####in slammin or I am gonna puke with all this forestry talk!!!!!:skeleton:
Just razzin ya
Just razzin ya
My camera keeps getting too cold and refuses to work once I crawl through all the brush. Besides, the only ones working are the fallers....
And unusual for here, the faller has a young man along who is learning by bucking and limbing.
Bring it!
tramp bushler
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My camera keeps getting too cold and refuses to work once I crawl through all the brush. Besides, the only ones working are the fallers....
And unusual for here, the faller has a young man along who is learning by bucking and limbing.
If you have a case for it try putting a chemical hand or toe warmer in the bottom of the case and your camera on top of it . I do that with my cell/smart phone in a chest pocket . It works good.
Thanks Tramp. I'll buy some handwarmers for that purpose. It was too wet for the ultra zoom camera today so no pictures of falling. I like to be out of range when they are falling. That way I don't slow them down and I'm out of the way.
forestryworks
Addicted to ArboristSite
And another roadside hazard.
forestryworks
Addicted to ArboristSite
No Mountain Pine Beetle here in southeast Oklahoma. Just Southern Pine Beetle.
Metals406
Granfodder Runningsaw
And another roadside hazard.
Looking good Jameson. . . Why the snipe on the stump?
forestryworks
Addicted to ArboristSite
Just trying them out on these freshly dead trees. Seeing what it does and doesn't do.
I forgot to look though, I was watching the top, lol.
