Fuel ratio

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Dude... relax... you're not the first to come on here with both barrels blazin' tryin' to justify usin' an oil ratio like 32:1 or even more oil.

You can hide behind all the "EPA" stuff you want... 50:1 with newer modern mix oils is perfectly fine.

Have fun! :popcorn:

Gary



Certified AS "overengineering" inspector...
 
Same Old

Seems we're going around in the same old Oil Thread circles.
Gary and Andy I admire your patience.
My 2 cents:
Oils have got better over the years.
Old saws have low stress engines and can easily be lubricated by modern oils at recommended ratios.
You will have to adjust the H mixture to take account of modern ratios.
For everyone who uses higher than recommended ratios have you done the same thousands of hours research and testing that the oil companies do before launching a new oil?
(I'm presuming Gary has elves to do this bit for him so that he can get on with the more fun parts of being an Oil Baron)
 
Yeah, it really isn't that hard to understand to just mix 50:1 with good synthetic designed for chainsaws but for some reason people come close to fighting to the death arguing otherwise. :dizzy: It's like taking the simplest aspect of runnin a saw and turnin it into the hardest.
 
Point Blank Question

Dude... relax... you're not the first to come on here with both barrels blazin' tryin' to justify usin' an oil ratio like 32:1 or even more oil.

You can hide behind all the "EPA" stuff you want... 50:1 with newer modern mix oils is perfectly fine.

Have fun! :popcorn:

Gary

Gary --
People will always have different opinions. But, I HIDE BEHIND NOTHING!!
Don't need to.
Oil [in the gas of saws] is the #1 enemy of EPA standards. Doubt it?
Why have [2] cycles had the toughest time meeting the increasingly tough standards?
Many High-Perf [2] stroke users [Karts, etc.] would consider it insane to run 50:1. A good number are running 12:1 to 16:1 with the finest oils made.
They want their stuff to live.
Suzuki for a number of years refered to their engines as "Oil Cooled".
As a fact, all engines are oil cooled--one of oils big benefits! If you have enough....

I don't have 22,000 posts on AS. Many AS readers buy hook/line/sinker what is posted.
Sad.
*** As stated earlier their is a huge difference in "running fine" & maintaining that high level of perf [compression PSI, etc.] indefinitely.
So many AS posts complaining of poor/low perf. WHY?

Quick, short little posts that think they sum it all up, don't.
Nothing here "over-engineeered".

In my town is a Rental Company. I know the Owner & Mngr. Sharp operators.
They rent chainsaws & a full line of other [2] cycle stuff, skid-steers and everything inbetween.
Rental is a tough life for saws. Tougher than most any of that we dish out.
As confirmation, STIHL offers a whopping 30 day warranty for Rental use.
Hurrah!
One has to be sharp & smart to rent Chainsaws and make money!
The Rental Co owner told me he always went by the Manufacturors suggestions, 50:1.

Said he got tired of rebuilding them, and the parts cost.
Went to 32:1. No rebuilds at all. Some have now been actively in his fleet for
10years. No one will convince him that 50:1 is smart. Especially his hip-pocket.

The newer Syn Oils make 50:1 work "fine" as you stated.
I'm not after "fine". Oil is cheap.
I want want the best. That's the point of this post and to Lumberjach.
His Mac 33 dern sure was not CNC machined/built. We don't know anything of it's internal condition either, do we?
A bit extra oil is a WISE and prudent measure.
Many other AS memebers agree wholeheartedly.
They just don't rock the established boat like I do.
 
Go garts / trail bikes have ring lifetimes measured in less than 100 hours... Pro Saws - way over 2500 - oh.. with 50:1, even dino oil. Think there is something different?

And.. Epa... nothing has changed with the oil or ratios from pre-epa to post epa... they are still 50:1... even for 1989, 1998 or 2010.


As for your rental example... so the customer ONLY uses the gas mix the Rental company provides (if any)..? sure...
 
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Go garts / trail bikes have ring lifetimes measured in less than 100 hours... Pro Saws - way over 2500 - oh.. with 50:1, even dino oil. Think there is something different?

And.. Epa... nothing has changed with the oil or ratios from pre-epa to post epa... they are still 50:1... even for 1989, 1998 or 2010.


As for your rental example... so the customer ONLY uses the gas mix the Rental company provides (if any)..? sure...

You tell 'im Lake! Let the newbie see the light!
 
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Go garts / trail bikes have ring lifetimes measured in less than 100 hours... Pro Saws - way over 2500 - oh.. with 50:1, even dino oil. Think there is something different?

And.. Epa... nothing has changed with the oil or ratios from pre-epa to post epa... they are still 50:1... even for 1989, 1998 or 2010.


As for your rental example... so the customer ONLY uses the gas mix the Rental company provides (if any)..? sure...

YES !
The Rental company sends all the Fuel out with the saws, and charges for it.
All trail bikes I'm aware of last far more than 100 hrs. [not MX]
 
Whatever works

Just another overengineer... LMAO... :laugh:

Gary


Gary --
After reading a number of your posts from various topics, I see your thought process.
"Whatever works for ME is written in stone as great, and is God".

you've got a lot of experience w/equipment...
some of the tech stuff [Tillotson carb] is super.

Both no one knows it all.

Engines/carbs/running >>> 50:1 is only 2% oil.
We are not using the "bottle" of oil at a time.
Only a very small fraction, "vaporized" with my
piston going up and down @ 200 times per
second!
Very, very, very little ACTUAL oil.

I choose to "err" with a bit more oil. 32:1 is only about 3%. real big deal....
Still, not much oil!

Many AS members run richer than 50:1.
Any problem with erring towards more, if I can afford it??
 
Stihl has maintained since the mid 80's that running more oil than in 50:1 will increase carbon and reduce life. They had no reason to say this other than for engine life. Heck, they'd sell more oil at 40:1.

Funny thing is.. most other major manfs say to use the same 50:1 ratio.
 
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YES !
The Rental company sends all the Fuel out with the saws, and charges for it.
All trail bikes I'm aware of last far more than 100 hrs. [not MX]

As for the fuel.. I suspect any increase in life was simple due to the customer not using the drain gas from the lawnmower. Most rental saws get very few hours on them before resale.

Bikes... You were talking "high performance".. Check the recommended ring change hours - you'll be shocked.
 
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Stihl has maintained since the mid 80's that running more oil than in 50:1 will increase carbon and reduce life. They had no reason to say this other than for engine life. Heck, they'd sell more oil at 40:1

:agree2:

As it was explained to me, the more oil in the mix, the more carbon generated, and the more carbon generated and running through the engine the greater the wear. Makes sense to me and my simple mind. :)
 
Gary --
After reading a number of your posts from various topics, I see your thought process.
"Whatever works for ME is written in stone as great, and is God".
/QUOTE]

I was going to stay out of this but....

Gary has posted more helpful stuff on here than you can read in a day. He's also probably run more different kinds of saws and cut more serious wood than you've ever seen. The same can be said of Lakeside.

You're acting like a child because he questions your ratio choice.

Run what you want to run...nobody really cares. But lay off the holier than thou attitude. There's tons of good information on here...try using some of it.
 
I never have claimed to be a know-it-all... err... wait. Yes I have. :laugh:

Anyways... It is amazing to me that there is so much stuff related to saws that people think has to be some voodoo ritual or your saw will melt where it sits...

This ain't rocket science... using an oil mix ratio for an old 33 from 1956 meant to use the oil from that era. Oils have changed since then... a lot!!! So, it's perfectly fine to use modern oils from today... in older saws at a more modern ratio. Runnin' 20:1 full synthetic "new" oil would be silly. I use 50:1 synthetic in saws that old. I would say 40:1 would be just fine usin' the same oil.

Now then... If you wanna use 30wt SAE motor oil, or some ancient 2stroke dino oil... then you might wanna think about 20:1 or 32:1...

I just don't understand your arguement... :dizzy:

Gary
 

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