going bigger. ms460 7900

[THALL10326]

Hey Thall if he comes into your shop asking for 8 pin rims are you going to say no way? or take his cash and give the rims.

I think i know the answer lol the clue was in the word cash!

Checking my bin here, lets see, 8 pin, hmmmmmmm, raising the price as we speak,LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

[volks-man]

So tell me Volk why didn't you go ahead and get the 460, was it because the man said no discount and if so you should have explained to him why you are
deserving of one. You may have got a break.

Also a 8 pin on a 361 forwhat, only going to gain chain speed and lose torque. Speed for twigs, no power in big wood.Seems to me your nitpicking those dealers on what they charge and what they have in stock and what they know yet you aren't willing to pay them their price so really you shouldn't be talking about them at all.

Far as the car thing yes its very smart to buy local. Seems your only concern is price. I say be that way, my car will be getting fixed while yours is outside sitting there behind everyone else,LOLOL

nitpicking?!?
irrelevant! i asked for it you wouild think he wouild sell it.
i bought the f#&king bar and chain without a word about price or anything else (don't beleive me? pm and i'll give you his # and you can ask him. he is there till 5-ish today).
everything i have bought from him i have asked for and paid for without ever asking for any discount. plain and simple. i need to convince him (or any dealer) that i am worthy of a discount?
i buy my chain and all my mix (except 6 from you) and wedges and various parts from him. the only thing i have ever not bought from him based on price is the 460, today!.

yup. it's all about the price.

 

[volks-man]

To my untrained UK eye it would be the Mustang theres one in Inverness where i live and it looks and sounds awsome!

VW Bora 150 hp TDI 6 speed 0-60 in under 8 top book speed of 134 mph out of a 1.9 L engine 37 mile run average of 60 mpg

60 mpg! that is too unamerican for us!!!
now if it were 06 mpg now were talking.

 

[THALL10326]

nitpicking?!?
irrelevant! i asked for it you wouild think he wouild sell it.
i bought the f#&king bar and chain without a word about price or anything else (don't beleive me? pm and i'll give you his # and you can ask him. he is there till 5-ish today).
everything i have bought from him i have asked for and paid for. plain and simple. i need to convince him (or any dealer) that i am worthy of a discount?
i buy my chain and all my mix (except 6 from you) and wedges and various parts from him. the only thing i have ever not bought from him based on price is the 460, today!.

yup. it's all about the price.

Missing the point Volk. You groan casue the other dealer didn't have one. The dealer that did have one you wouldn't buy it so whats the beef with the dealers?

Worthy of a discount is not what I said. I said you should have explained to him why you are deserving of one, big differance. Can you come up with a justified reason why you should pay less than his other customers, I'm all ears...

 

[scotclayshooter]

60 mpg! that is too unamerican for us!!!
now if it were 06 mpg now were talking.

Same performance figures as the 1.8 Turbo petrol that only makes mid 30s mpg

The Bora is fairly torquey 236lb/ft at 1900rpm
Anything over 1200 rpm and its a flyer!

A gallon here is 4.546 Litres I gather the figures are maybe a little missleading as a gallon is less litres with you guys?

 

[volks-man]

Missing the point Volk. You groan casue the other dealer didn't have one. The dealer that did have one you wouldn't buy it so whats the beef with the dealers?

Worthy of a discount is not what I said. I said you should have explained to him why you are deserving of one, big differance. Can you come up with a justified reason why you should pay less than his other customers, I'm all ears...

nope.
you missed the point mr. hall. go re-read my post. i did not groan about the second dealer not having the saw. i only mentioned him to illustrate my trying the local boys. if they had had it maybe i would be deserving of a discout as a repeat saw-buying customer.

i was in my guys store a week ago and the price on the wall was 829.00. no way he sold one between then and now and has to mark up because his price went up. list price is a joke. go buy anything else (other than a saw) at list and you will be told you got raped.

 

[scotclayshooter]

Our local dealer has on his shelves ms180s ms290s and 1 ms280 with IEM
Everything else is ordered in!

 

[volks-man]

Same performance figures as the 1.8 Turbo petrol that only makes mid 30s mpg

The Bora is fairly torquey 236lb/ft at 1900rpm
Anything over 1200 rpm and its a flyer!

A gallon here is 4.546 Litres I gather the figures are maybe a little missleading as a gallon is less litres with you guys?

vdub tdi golf and jetta over here got 43 mpg tops as i recall. that was a couple years ago and not sure if they have re-itroduced them yet after the 06 model changes.
not sure about the conversion for imperial gallons and us gallons but your car still looks impressive with the 60mpg showing!

 

[scotclayshooter]

vdub tdi golf and jetta over here got 43 mpg tops as i recall. that was a couple years ago and not sure if they have re-itroduced them yet after the 06 model changes.
not sure about the conversion for imperial gallons and us gallons but your car still looks impressive with the 60mpg showing!

The Bora is a Golf with a boot so i guess its a Jetta with you mine is a 2003 car.
The Bora works out £2500 cheaper than the same model of Golf
The hatchback is king here!

 

[volks-man]

The Bora is a Golf with a boot so i guess its a Jetta with you mine is a 2003 car.
The Bora works out £2500 cheaper than the same model of Golf
The hatchback is king here!

back in the 80s we had a lot of hatchbacks over here too.
gas prices went down and stayed down long enough that we all got in to the bigger cars again over time. now people are driving the ford excursion and chevy suburban (if you don't know you need to look them up!). these are landmass sized vehicles.
us 'mericans won't figure 'it' out till the oil runs out and we are all forced to ride to work on skateboards!

 

[scotclayshooter]

back in the 80s we had a lot of hatchbacks over here too.
gas prices went down and stayed down long enough that we all got in to the bigger cars again over time. now people are driving the ford excursion and chevy suburban (if you don't know you need to look them up!). these are landmass sized vehicles.
us 'mericans won't figure 'it' out till the oil runs out and we are all forced to ride to work on skateboards!

Yep we had Big 4x4s coming out of the woodwork here for a while most were just used for the school run!
But when fuel prices went through the roof and the Gov hit the bigger vehicles wth double the road tax to £400 a year it killed them off a fair bit!
The Bora is £120 a year!
Timberwolf was telling me the 130-150hp Diesels were not in Canada and the 6 speed was not either!
The new top version is 170 hp from a 2.0 TDI
The Audi range goes up to 2.5 and 3.0 TDIs and more torque than a Tractor!

 

[Wet1]

Our 2000 Jetta TDI gets 50 mpg if you keep it under ~72 mph. At 75-80 mph it still gets about 47 mpg. It has over 300k on the clock now and still going strong... have only changed brakes, struts, tires, belts, oil, and a MAF sensor. We've though about getting rid of it, but it still runs great so we use it when we know we'll be racking some miles up.


Volks, it sounds like you should go pay your $tihl dealer full list price, plus an extra $100 for the privilege, and because I'm sure he's a great guy and would fix your saw for you (if under warranty) should it break. I don't think Husky or Dolmar dealers will or can fix saws should they break. So while you might save a lot of money on that 7900 which has significantly more power and weighs less, the POS would probably break and it could never ever be fixed.

This thread is certainly amusing...

 

[scotclayshooter]

Our 2000 Jetta TDI gets 50 mpg if you keep it under ~72 mph. At 75-80 mph it still gets about 47 mpg. It has over 300k on the clock now and still going strong... have only changed brakes, struts, tires, belts, oil, and a MAF sensor. We've though about getting rid of it, but it still runs great so we use it when we know we'll be racking some miles up.

This thread is certainly amusing...

Whats the HP? 6 speed?
The 150 i have has the best econ figures of all the TDIs apart from the 90 hp.
Yep at 80 it still does 47MPG the speedo is 2 mph out so thats 80 on the sat nav

 

[volks-man]

Volks, it sounds like you should go pay your $tihl dealer full list price, plus an extra $100 for the privilege, and because I'm sure he's a great guy and would fix your saw for you (if under warranty) should it break. I don't think Husky or Dolmar dealers will or can fix saws should they break. So while you might save a lot of money on that 7900 which has significantly more power and weighs less, the POS would probably break and it could never ever be fixed.

This thread is certainly amusing...

hey wet,
bad weather up your way today, no? good thing you nort-east guys are all issued 10 cases of clam chowder for the winter!!!!

i am glad there are two of us who see eye to eye on this. i keep responding to these posts to see if there are any like minded people around.
seems a guy like me can do no right.
i say i want to order a saw, they say go to a dealer.
i go to a dealer they say you gotta deserve a discount.
i ask why they say bcuz. even though the west coast price is only 719.00.
i say what else is bought because of the dealer network?
they say, 'don't care, pay up!'
i say am i the only one to look at a price tag?
they say 'don't care, pay up'!
damn i love the ARBORISTSITE!

 

[Paul001]

hey wet,
bad weather up your way today, no? good thing you nort-east guys are all issued 10 cases of clam chowder for the winter!!!!

i am glad there are two of us who see eye to eye on this. i keep responding to these posts to see if there are any like minded people around.
seems a guy like me can do no right.
i say i want to order a saw, they say go to a dealer.
i go to a dealer they say you gotta deserve a discount.
i ask why they say bcuz. even though the west coast price is only 719.00.
i say what else is bought because of the dealer network?
they say, 'don't care, pay up!'
i say am i the only one to look at a price tag?
they say 'don't care, pay up'!
damn i love the ARBORISTSITE!

Several sides to this conversation and it appears your side is the only one you feel is valid.

You have lots of choices, order after market. Go to E-bay. Find another dealer.

The MSRP is just that, a suggestion. Cost of doing business is slightly different in Conn. or Long Island than say Ohio or Georgia. Thats partly why you'll see prices vary.

My shop, I am fortunate. We deal strictly with the trade. We don't get the shoppers, those wanting to spend 30 minutes of my time explaining how to adjust their saw by ear, change their own fuel filter or the merits of going with a 250 vs a 441. For parts, it's contractors calling/stopping in for what they need, we have it, charge a fair price (that will let us keep the doors open), they pay it, and get back to work.

We also get fan mail sent to Stihl by other dealers because of our advertised prices, 660 at $980 or 84DL RSC loops at $16. Again, because are not selling one at a time, we can afford to do so.

You need to make a decision, do you want to deal with the box store mentality...meaning your saw breaks, hell if we know how to fix it, what could be wrong, or even where to get it fixed (keep in mind if you are here you are less than 1% of the saw owners out there that can/will work on their own saw). Your parts/equipment purchases help offset the cost of those mechanics in back, the shop, heat, servicing the debt load on all that merchandise sitting on the selves, etc.

I'll be the first to admit, lots of dealers out there that need a refresher on customer service. There are also alot more customers who need to re-look why they might not be getting a discount from someone they do business with.

So the choice is yours support your local dealer, establish a relationship with another dealer, hell ask for a discount...I do so even with my local gas station sometimes I get one sometimes I don't but I ask.

But if you think service and support doesn't matter, to you that might be true, to the majority of the buyers out there it does.

"The bitterness of poor quality/service remains long after the thrill of a good deal fades"

Anyway, just my thoughts, feel free to dismiss out of hand, seeing as I'm just another of those ####ing Stihl guys.

 

[davefr]

i asked what he coiuld do for a 460 and he said whatever was on the tag, $879.00.

It sounds like you didn't even attempt to negotiate. Asking for the price is not negotiation.

You should have asked for a "repeat customer" discount in return for an instant sale. Or offer him cash. If that didn't work, them ask him to throw in some extras. (like high margin bars and chains)

Did you ask dealer #2 for a discount since the saw had to be back ordered. (ie remind him he didn't have to carry the inventory).

I agree Stihl has a pricing problem. It's not necessarily the pricing but the strategy. I can't think of any other example where the consumer is expected to pay full MSRP. (cars, furniture, electronics, groceries). The consumer is programmed to think paying MSRP is getting screwed. Stihl has an uphill perception battle sticking with this policy.

Maybe they should do what every other manufacturer does and jack up the price and then offer various forms of discounts/promotions.

 

[volks-man]

Several sides to this conversation and it appears your side is the only one you feel is valid.
You have lots of choices, order after market. Go to E-bay. Find another dealer.

The MSRP is just that, a suggestion. Cost of doing business is slightly different in Conn. or Long Island than say Ohio or Georgia. Thats partly why you'll see prices vary.

My shop, I am fortunate. We deal strictly with the trade. We don't get the shoppers, those wanting to spend 30 minutes of my time explaining how to adjust their saw by ear, change their own fuel filter or the merits of going with a 250 vs a 441. For parts, it's contractors calling/stopping in for what they need, we have it, charge a fair price (that will let us keep the doors open), they pay it, and get back to work.

We also get fan mail sent to Stihl by other dealers because of our advertised prices, 660 at $980 or 84DL RSC loops at $16. Again, because are not selling one at a time, we can afford to do so.

You need to make a decision, do you want to deal with the box store mentality...meaning your saw breaks, hell if we know how to fix it, what could be wrong, or even where to get it fixed (keep in mind if you are here you are less than 1% of the saw owners out there that can/will work on their own saw). Your parts/equipment purchases help offset the cost of those mechanics in back, the shop, heat, servicing the debt load on all that merchandise sitting on the selves, etc.

I'll be the first to admit, lots of dealers out there that need a refresher on customer service. There are also alot more customers who need to re-look why they might not be getting a discount from someone they do business with.

So the choice is yours support your local dealer, establish a relationship with another dealer, hell ask for a discount...I do so even with my local gas station sometimes I get one sometimes I don't but I ask.

But if you think service and support doesn't matter, to you that might be true, to the majority of the buyers out there it does.

"The bitterness of poor quality/service remains long after the thrill of a good deal fades"

Anyway, just my thoughts, feel free to dismiss out of hand, seeing as I'm just another of those ####ing Stihl guys.

howdy paul. welcome to the forum!
i appreciate your thoughts.
no, i dont feel only my side is valid. i am willing to be flexible. however, for me to agree with the other fellas in this thread, seems i would have to go buy the 460 at list. or convince a dealer to 'please sell me a saw' at a discount.
my last post does show some of my disgust for the other fellows not looking at it from the buyers point of view. if the last post was out of line, then chock it up to my being tired of defending my looking at a price tag, ect.
i will not dismiss you out of hand. i never have had a problem with ":censored: stihl guys" anyway.

can't we all just get along?

 

[volks-man]

It sounds like you didn't even attempt to negotiate. Asking for the price is not negotiation.
You should have asked for a "repeat customer" discount in return for an instant sale. Or offer him cash. If that didn't work, them ask him to throw in some extras. (like high margin bars and chains)

Did you ask dealer #2 for a discount since the saw had to be back ordered. (ie remind him he didn't have to carry the inventory).

I agree Stihl has a pricing problem. It's not necessarily the pricing but the strategy. I can't think of any other example where the consumer is expected to pay full MSRP. (cars, furniture, electronics, groceries). The consumer is programmed to think paying MSRP is getting screwed. Stihl has an uphill perception battle sticking with this policy.

Maybe they should do what every other manufacturer does and jack up the price and then offer various forms of discounts/promotions.

hey dave,
as he was ready to tally up my stuff my dealer asked if there was anything else i wanted. i said, 'what kind of deal can you give me on the 460?". he told me 'whats on the wall'. this was not a playfull exchange. that sounded like no negotiating to me. perhaps i could have tried harder. though he does see me enough to remember me. he and i have never had any problems and i guess i am already a repeat cutomer.

no. i was driving home and had the wife call and ask if they had one and how much. they told her they did not but they did have a 441, the wife said thank you and hung up.

 

[Paul001]

howdy paul.
i appreciate your thoughts.
no, i dont feel only my side is valid. i am willing to be flexible. however, for me to agree with the other fellas in this thread, seems i would have to go buy the 460 at list. or convince a dealer to 'please sell me a saw' at a discount.
my last post does show some of my disgust for the other fellows not looking at it from the buyers point of view. if the last post was out of line, then chock it up to my being tired of defending my looking at a price tag, ect.
i will not dismiss you out of hand. i never have had a problem with ":censored: stihl guys" anyway.

can't we all just get along?

Thanks was kind of worried that my style of putting things rather bluntly would come across as being a prick with you.

No question dealers need to remember we are a service based industry and customers have choices. We are also on the high end with regards to prices in our industry, we have to earn that extra monies.

As far as asking "pretty please". Screw that. Lay it on the line. "You want $600 for that saw. I'd like to buy it, but I'd like to do a little better. I've purchased X number of saws from you, I'd like to do all future business with you as well. I'm willing to pay $550." He'll either say yes or no. If no, then ask for freebies. If he still says no, head on down to the next dealer. Just don't be surprised if/when you need service work in the future and your unit is lower priority than someone else's.

My issue with your posts was with regards to your dismissal of service. If you do not make your living with those saws, I could agree with you. For those of us who do/have, service and availability of parts is a major reason for buying from one dealership/brand or another. When I was running 3 crews, I could not afford to have an 200T or three sitting on a shops shelf for 2 or 3 weeks. I'd buy another and part those out. My local shop stocked the parts to keep us up and running, put someone on our saws as soon as we came in, and had us up and running within a day if not sooner. Never did we question the price as that service was worth way to much to us.

Currently with the other commercial equipment we sell, someone buys a 60K brush chipper from us, he's losing 2K per day while he waits for us to get him up and running. If we can't get him going within 48 hours, he has a loaner unit on the back of his truck.

That service is why people are willing to buy from us and spend an extra 4-10K to do so.

Service and specifically great service is worth the extra money. In your case it appears either the dealer is not providing you with what you feel is great service or your expiations are a bit to high.

 

[volks-man]

Thanks was kind of worried that my style of putting things rather bluntly would come across as being a prick with you.

No question dealers need to remember we are a service based industry and customers have choices. We are also on the high end with regards to prices in our industry, we have to earn that extra monies.

As far as asking "pretty please". Screw that. Lay it on the line. "You want $600 for that saw. I'd like to buy it, but I'd like to do a little better. I've purchased X number of saws from you, I'd like to do all future business with you as well. I'm willing to pay $550." He'll either say yes or no. If no, then ask for freebies. If he still says no, head on down to the next dealer. Just don't be surprised if/when you need service work in the future and your unit is lower priority than someone else's.

My issue with your posts was with regards to your dismissal of service. If you do not make your living with those saws, I could agree with you. For those of us who do/have, service and availability of parts is a major reason for buying from one dealership/brand or another. When I was running 3 crews, I could not afford to have an 200T or three sitting on a shops shelf for 2 or 3 weeks. I'd buy another and part those out. My local shop stocked the parts to keep us up and running, put someone on our saws as soon as we came in, and had us up and running within a day if not sooner. Never did we question the price as that service was worth way to much to us.

Currently with the other commercial equipment we sell, someone buys a 60K brush chipper from us, he's losing 2K per day while he waits for us to get him up and running. If we can't get him going within 48 hours, he has a loaner unit on the back of his truck.

That service is why people are willing to buy from us and spend an extra 4-10K to do so.

Service and specifically great service is worth the extra money. In your case it appears either the dealer is not providing you with what you feel is great service or your expiations are a bit to high.

i see your concerns. if i were a pro with men and money held up on someone fixin my equipment service would be a problem. but i am just a guy cutting firewood. i have only ever had one saw serviced one time. the problem was a fluke at that. a factory defect that was promptly repaired by a member of AS and paid for by the manufacturer.

it has been made clear early on in this thread that my needs are more than filled with the stihls i already have. and that outside of warranty service all of my repairs are done in-house. so service to me is a non issue.

the other guys are saying that above all else i need to have a dealer, nearby, and stocking parts. don't forget that price is no object. i am the only guy they ever met who looks at a price tag. no one should have to explain to a dealer why they 'diserve' a discount. give me one or don't.

paul, keep your comments coming (not just here). i think you could be a value to AS.