A & E...The art and Zen of the Grunt (Groundworker)

[TreeTarget]

Then what do you find so esoteric and time consuming about it? Hey, I understand some more involved set ups can be , uhm, more involved but really it shouldn't take long.
One thing that might add time to set-up is when the groundies have no concept or iniatiative to do it.

Concept, no...I have various skills, abilities and qualifications...but when it comes to safely lowering weight from on high, I am yes...a "groundie," and have no clue...but am more than willing to see the endeavor through. Never doubt the resolve...only the lack of information...

Not to chide, but...do you know enough to assist in my endeavors? Be patient, and you may see some value in the protests of those with a different perspective...however you would like to interpret that...
Sum o that ther lernin's we got in the skull frum erli on maa not seem fancy-butt we durn shur member wat we was shone sow fur.

 

[Blakesmaster]

One thing that might add time to set-up is when the groundies have no concept or iniatiative to do it.

That there is the issue. Having a groundie, or better yet a climber on the ground, that has experience with zip lines is the key. How much time did we spend on our zip line, Dano? Maybe 5 minutes to set up? All of which you did as I was running up the tree so essentially no time was lost at all. I've seen some pretty elaborate setups that seemed a waste of time. All you really need is a good running line and a few loopies and biners. Provided you have a good landing zone a zip line is a cinch; it's quick to set up, super efficient and WAY more professional than letting a shaky-kneed groundie clamber around on the HO's roof.

 

[Blakesmaster]

It's also worth noting that HO's always get all wide eyed with wonder at a properly executed zip line. All smiles with checkbook in hand when you get down. Don't know 'bout you guys but I like that in an HO.

 

[treevet]

It's also worth noting that HO's always get all wide eyed with wonder at a properly executed zip line. .

So do tree guys. They are over rated when compared to just giving it to a skilled gm on the roof most of the time.

Speed lines have their place but, like you said, on forums tree guys go all gah gah, along with PPE, spouting speed line rhetoric when it comes to perceiving themselves as being head and shoulders above the crowd.

 

[treemandan]

So do tree guys. They are over rated when compared to just giving it to a skilled gm on the roof most of the time.

Speed lines have their place but, like you said, on forums tree guys go all gah gah, along with PPE, spouting speed line rhetoric when it comes to perceiving themselves as being head and shoulders above the crowd.

I hear what you are saying and will say no more about it except that in many situations where setting up a SL would have been beneficial the guys seemed to rather break their asses off and fight it every step of the way for me. I am glad you are not one of those stubborn sods but I have to also tell ya I haven't seen to many people I would trust working on a roof. And personally I would rather avoid a roof entirely. Sometimes ( well it seems like always) you have to make it easy for them. They will appreciate it... for a few seconds so don't turn around to fast.
A few have stuck with me and found the glory it beholds.

 

[treemandan]

But anyway, Treetarget, this is your post and we have to figure out if you are full of crap or not still I think. I am dwelling on what you have said and will get back to you shortly as I never like to leave a man hanging... for too long

 

[treemandan]

One last note before I get back to making chains and drinking beer so cold it will crack yer teeth:

I will SHOW you how to do that there speedline, yessir, I will.

 

[tree md]

Man, I really love beer so cold it'll crack yer teeth... Having to lay off right now.

 

[treemandan]

That there is the issue. Having a groundie, or better yet a climber on the ground, that has experience with zip lines is the key. How much time did we spend on our zip line, Dano? Maybe 5 minutes to set up? All of which you did as I was running up the tree so essentially no time was lost at all. I've seen some pretty elaborate setups that seemed a waste of time. All you really need is a good running line and a few loopies and biners. Provided you have a good landing zone a zip line is a cinch; it's quick to set up, super efficient and WAY more professional than letting a shaky-kneed groundie clamber around on the HO's roof.

That was a peach yes? Whose idea was it? I think you. Wouldn't want to lower out of that thing would ya?

 

[TreeTarget]

But anyway, Treetarget, this is your post and we have to figure out if you are full of crap or not still I think. I am dwelling on what you have said and will get back to you shortly as I never like to leave a man hanging... for too long

Cannot deny that I am full of something, but whatever it is, it hasn't turned completely to crap...yet.
Like I said, I have been trying...actually worked on a roof the other day, and YES, even told the boss I wouldn't mind learning "the ropes," if he is willing to teach climbing.

Hey there...no where near a pro, and yes sometimes get weak in the knees, but if my fear of heights (that I am working on) is the worst of my problems, then I think I'm doing pretty good so far. Believe me, I have known the boss for 20 years, and if I wasn't worth his time, he sure isn't one to tip-toe around letting me know. He's also right there to tell me when something that was taught to me years ago is coming from that bag-o-crap he considers unsafe and/or unacceptable...haven't had alot of those moments, as it is his business, not mine...He can take the lead, because I have alot to learn AND because I enjoy my work.

Especially today...but that's another story...

Looking forward to tomorrow...

Can't wait to see that speed line...we talk about it, but I haven't seen it yet...

 

[treemandan]

Cannot deny that I am full of something, but whatever it is, it hasn't turned completely to crap...yet.
Like I said, I have been trying...actually worked on a roof the other day, and YES, even told the boss I wouldn't mind learning "the ropes," if he is willing to teach climbing.

Hey there...no where near a pro, and yes sometimes get weak in the knees, but if my fear of heights (that I am working on) is the worst of my problems, then I think I'm doing pretty good so far. Believe me, I have known the boss for 20 years, and if I wasn't worth his time, he sure isn't one to tip-toe around letting me know. He's also right there to tell me when something that was taught to me years ago is coming from that bag-o-crap he considers unsafe and/or unacceptable...haven't had alot of those moments, as it is his business, not mine...He can take the lead, because I have alot to learn AND because I enjoy my work.

Especially today...but that's another story...

Looking forward to tomorrow...

Can't wait to see that speed line...we talk about it, but I haven't seen it yet...

I am going to have to sober up a little before we can talk but I will leave you with this: Its not the fall that kills ya.

 

[Blakesmaster]

That was a peach yes? Whose idea was it? I think you. Wouldn't want to lower out of that thing would ya?

I think me indeed. And nosiree I wasn't keen on lowering out that tree. Didn't you like how the zip line set the butts nice and respectfully in a pile facing the chipper and you needn't drag one piece of brush? That tree could not have been done better than we did it that day. Without a crane that is...

 

[tree md]

I think everyone experiences a little vertigo when they first start working at heights. Just natural instinct. Most guys who make it as climbers overcome it pretty quickly. Example, you see the new guy with sewing machine legs on his first couple/few trees, by the end of the week there is no more shaking legs and he is giving a rebel yell after he tops his first tree.

Some guys go up their first tree and say #### this! Lol, I've had to spend over an hour talking one down before. No shame in it. Everyone needs groundmen too. Personally, tight spots get me. I am perfectly happy in the top of a tree but put me under a house in a crawl space and I freak!

 

[treemandan]

I think me indeed. And nosiree I wasn't keen on lowering out that tree. Didn't you like how the zip line set the butts nice and respectfully in a pile facing the chipper and you needn't drag one piece of brush? That tree could not have been done better than we did it that day. Without a crane that is...

Well for two guys taking down a hazzard poplar...

I do a lot of sub work and the bawss will come around and complain that all the guys are standing around quietly watching me get set up. I say " they are getting used to me, its a prerequisite".
But they are made to go elsewheres and by the time they get back they are just as clueless.

 

[TreeTarget]

I am going to have to sober up a little before we can talk but I will leave you with this: Its not the fall that kills ya.

I know that for a fact...and I remember the "fall" quite well. If there is one moment from that day, I can say that I was most alive, aware and can remember details and almost taste the air as it was...it was in that moment or so.

I never have a problem with the falling part...it is ALWAYS the failing to miss the ground part that bugs me...I have failed at so many things throughout the ages...death (working on that one), taxes, beating the system, being on the right side of affirmative action, quitting smoking, not looking at other women, utilizing my potential...

Why not this? A simple thing to accomplish...I can shoot ANY gun and miss the target...what is so special about the ground...?

 

[treemandan]

I know that for a fact...and I remember the "fall" quite well. If there is one moment from that day, I can say that I was most alive, aware and can remember details and almost taste the air as it was...it was in that moment or so.

I never have a problem with the falling part...it is ALWAYS the failing to miss the ground part that bugs me...I have failed at so many things throughout the ages...death (working on that one), taxes, beating the system, being on the right side of affirmative action, quitting smoking, not looking at other women, utilizing my potential...

Why not this? A simple thing to accomplish...I can shoot ANY gun and miss the target...what is so special about the ground...?

When some time crunching bawss has you up on the roof huckin limbs over the side on a hot Missouri July at 4:45 on a friday afternoon and one of those limbs that you just used all your might to huck hooks onto your shirt and takes you with it...
Well the bawss is justified, he has WC.

 

[treemandan]

Real good call on that poplar Blakes. Thanks.

 

[ddhlakebound]

When some time crunching bawss has you up on the roof huckin limbs over the side on a hot Missouri July at 4:45 on a friday afternoon and one of those limbs that you just used all your might to huck hooks onto your shirt and takes you with it...
Well the bawss is justified, he has WC.

Hey there.....I'm no time crunching bawss. And by 4:45 on a hot july friday afternoon if the job isn't done, then the site is clean and we're gone. And none of the small limbs tossed (no hucking necessary) from the rooftop were big enough to require full use of might. And they were all cut FROM the rooftop, not lowered down to it.

But the justified part....hmmmm....maybe not....cause I have no WC.

 

[TreeTarget]

When some time crunching bawss has you up on the roof huckin limbs over the side on a hot Missouri July at 4:45 on a friday afternoon and one of those limbs that you just used all your might to huck hooks onto your shirt and takes you with it...
Well the bawss is justified, he has WC.

sho nuff...
well, thank you mr. nuff

 

[TreeTarget]

There was nothing dangerous about the limbs, the way they were lowered, or the way they were ejected from the area...the problem was mine...heights...

I know that snags and jerks and a million other things are going, could, will, are, might happen...I may get alot of work done, or not...but there is a reason I move slow and still live. Paying attention is alot of what I am paid for...

Besides, I am independently wealthy (working on that), don't have to work but enjoy the feeling of a hard day when I lay down at night, and "I" tell the boss what I will be paid for the day...well, not today since...again, another story...