The Chainsawr's Efco Story (Please read this if you're considering buying one.)

[REJ2]

The emissions standards are tough (no 2 stokes in California), how long before the major brands start selling 4 strokes in NAmerica in greater numbers?

PS
My Makita works really well, love it, in fact; but I don't do a lot of cutting, and it it's a tree, I choose my workhorse, the Solo656 (or the EFCO).

No 2 strokes in California? What?
Outlawing 2 strokes all together would just about level the playing field and wipe the slate clean. Who ever is leading the game now with four strokes probably aint that far ahead.
Might need to start rat holeing 2 stroke mix oils like primers, powder, and lead just in case.

 

[bigredd]

If I'm not mistaken, California and several states have restrictions or banned 2 stroke outboard motors on certain lakes and rivers. Not too long ago there were no 4 stroke outboards, now there's hardly any that are not. Honda makes true 4 stroke trimmers that have good reviews. IMO, it's just a matter of time before most all new chainsaws will be 4 stroke. It will probably take a Government mandate though.

 

[Philbert]

Looking at EFCO's lines, there's hardly any hot rods, or anything even competitive. 60cc backpack blower, mediocre air values, fairly standard weed whackers, and saws that are not boat anchors but don't drop any jaws on specs or weight or features.

Actually, you post make me think of how some of these 'third line' brands actually owe a big part of their sales to STIHL and Husquvarna.

When the big guys prohibited on-line and (most) home center sales, places like Bailey's, Menard's, etc., had to find brands that they could sell. Not saying that the servicing dealer-only sales policies are 'wrong', but if they opened it up to anybody, the only place you would see some of these other saws is on Mike Acres site.

Philbert

 

[spike60]

Why do I associated 'Robin' with Subaru instead of Makita?

Thanks

Philbert

Robin sold their 4 stroke business to Subaru and sold their hand held business to Makita. Those were nice little trimmers with good power to weight ratios. In commercial use the good selling 251's would suffer gear box failures, but it was otherwise good stuff. Some of these trimmers were also made in orange for Dolmar.

 

[7sleeper]

As a general trend more and more companies are recognizing that profit margins are slowly declining in China and are comming back to western contries. The problems that they suffer there and here in are just to dominant.

Although a lot of flak has hit efco here I still want to get one of the middle class models. I understand the critique about distribution, warrenty claims and not having any hot rods. Hot rods were, in my understanding, never the goal of their products. They have, as someone else put it, italien bulls plowing through whatever stands in their way. Equaly tough as everyone else. And if I can get one for less than a major brand I couldn't care less because how much warrenty work is really ever needed. But thanks for the head up on the "on-off" switches.

7

 

[Machold]

7Sleeper, go for it. I think the Efco's have suffered in North America for lack of brand recognition (and too often confused with Echo) while being well known in Europe (why they chose the name, Efco, I can't imagine when OleoMak & Olympik were not total strangers). I take the point about warranty service & parts, but as small engines go, they are among the best and form a powerful axis: Scandinavia, Germany and Italy (please, no world war jokes). Maybe they should be in the big box stores?

 

[belgian]

7Sleeper, go for it.

Well, if you look at the Efco business ethics judging by the way they handled chainsawr and their customers, I can hardly understand why someone would still buy their products.

Like Philbert already mentioned, it's probably a new sales strategy by some newly appointed management, that has to show some growing numbers in the short term. The h*ell with business ethics and relationships that took years to built.

This is what Stihl and Husqvarna made so successful ; they stick to their dealers, stand behind their products and think long term. Well worth a penny more, if you ask me.

 

[Great Smokies]

Interested to know what someone else asked- why only submit claims every 6 months? If I were the guy processing them I'd get very annoyed if I had a few a day to do then someone dropped odzens on me at once!

Also interested to see people say Efco will struggle to meet emmissions- as they just released 3 new models which obviously do meet it, how do you figure?

As for me, I have been happy with any Efco experience I've had. No, nothing above and beyond the norm to speak of (like the new XP Autotunes, say) but good, solid performance at good prices. And as ever, the OWNERS on this site are by and large overwhelmingly positive about their Efco's- the folks who knock them neither own or have run them.

Sorry to hear of the OP's woes...someof that must be to do with the distro deal changing I'd have thought. My local Efco dealer says he's had no issues at all iwth Efco or the distro regarding warranty...so. Who knows?

 

[Machold]

Life is beautiful in the Great Smokies.

 

[drkptt]

...
Also interested to see people say Efco will struggle to meet emmissions- as they just released 3 new models which obviously do meet it, how do you figure?
...

...and EU emission regs are as tight as the US EPA limits. And their vibration standards are higher.

 

[Jeff Lary]

To the OP I am sorry that they screwed you like they did that just plain sucks.It is very good of you to take the time to share this with everyone like an eairler post said the avg customer would never know about sheenanagins like this if someone did not tell us. It is also too bad they could not make a go of it with a worthwhile product. We all should remember, too few choices are never a good out come for the consumer be it saws or cars or anything else.

 

[Chris-PA]

Also interested to see people say Efco will struggle to meet emmissions- as they just released 3 new models which obviously do meet it, how do you figure?

What technology are they using to meet those regs?

EDIT: Looks like they have their own strato-type technology mechanically different from the RedMax/Husqvarna system. http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/173600.htm

If it works well and they can get their management issues straightened out maybe they're in a better position than Echo or Makita. On the other hand they're hardly a household name and RedMax chose to sell out in a somewhat similar situation.

 

[spike60]

What technology are they using to meet those regs?

EDIT: Looks like they have their own strato-type technology mechanically different from the RedMax/Husqvarna system. http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/173600.htm

If it works well and they can get their management issues straightened out maybe they're in a better position than Echo or Makita. On the other hand they're hardly a household name and RedMax chose to sell out in a somewhat similar situation.

Red Max was owned by Komatsu, another HUGE company, but hand held OPE was a little ways off course from their core business. I believe that Husky paid $150 million which I think was well worth it. Also, Husky also was working on stratos before the purchase actuaully took place. They were "on the same technology curve". They might have both been on the curve, but Red Max held the patents, which helped to make Husky a willing buyer. Call it a shotgun wedding! :msp_biggrin:

 

[7sleeper]

Well, if you look at the Efco business ethics judging by the way they handled chainsawr and their customers, I can hardly understand why someone would still buy their products.

Like Philbert already mentioned, it's probably a new sales strategy by some newly appointed management, that has to show some growing numbers in the short term. The h*ell with business ethics and relationships that took years to built.

This is what Stihl and Husqvarna made so successful ; they stick to their dealers, stand behind their products and think long term. Well worth a penny more, if you ask me.

Now this is really funny because if we look at the long term picture. How often have these companies with a luminous reputation gotten trampeld into dust in recent years because they are/were offering their products at big box stores? Oh yes their glorious dealers shouldn't be offering any replacement parts online as only one of the restraints, as far as I have understood, the complaints by some of the little/new dealers. And the amount of equipment that they have to aquire upfront is for many quite a major investment. Or the little "exclusive This or That contract" to become a dealership.

So this is how I see some of the hypocrisy proclaimed here by so many. If one company/dealer does it it's ok but for the others it's evil.

I donot doubt one bit that Efco is struggling in it's futile attemp to try to gain foot on the US market. They no doubt have a technology disadvantage (but even when they were technologicaly superior no one buyed their equipment[direct injection chainsaw MT4000]). And I donot approve of the way the complaints were handeld by the OP. But to eliminate a company for these mistakes is severly restricting your posiible choices.

If the comments/threads on AS in the past are in any way a indicator of the quality of Emak/Efco/Oleo Mac/Olympnik, then everyone should be running their equipment. I have never read of any other major brand having documented hundreds of refills in their middle class model. Or side by side comparison of their higher middle class models with the Stihl brand and getting an excellent result.

This is just embarrising for AS to jump onto this bandwagon.

7

 

[Machold]

Well, today I went to pick up parts for a B&S water pump engine; the dealer/service depot is also a Stihl dealer/service depot. We got talking and I asked were his saws still US/German made? Yes, all but the smallest one, Hecho en Mexico. He asked about my saws, I mentioned Efco; didn't know he said; made by OleoMak? yes, he knew that saw. I mentioned Mak/Dolmar, he said he used to be a Dolmar dealer because it was a great brand, but eventually gave up because parts were almost impossible to get. Bummer, I said. and mentioned that Efco in Canada was totally useless for parts etc. He surprised me when he said, well I have a helluva a time getting parts for Stihl through the local distributor! The dealer 25km away sells Husqvarna, and then added Echo, probably for the same reason: availability. The local TSC 30km away used to deal Jons, but has now switched to Echo.

Why am I not surprised? Because this is a perennial problem in Canada. The US pays less and gets more (economies of scale); we pay more and maybe don't get any, scale or no scale. Moral? Stihl, or Husky, or Dolmar, or Solo, or Efco, good luck in Canada! Homelite, Poulan? No problem!

 

[porsche965]

To the OP. If I'm not mistaken your Attorney General can help you with your warranty claims. And even thinking this through a bit more, since the warranty wasn't paid that makes you the bank for these consumers, the strongest part of your claim.

Possibly you could class action Efco with your customer's warranty claims even though you already paid them out of good conscious and moral responsiblity, which was the right thing to do.

Yep, I'd head to your Capital and go at it from a consumer's fraud standpoint. The fact that you haven't been paid makes it transparent and creates a "deep pockets" situation for Efco.

The Fed might not give a $^!+ about the small business man but the States on the other hand do care, you just have to reach the right person. Maybe even a State Rep would be a good guy to get on your side and open doors for you.

Just out of principle I would pack a bag lunch and take the trip to the Capital and plan on spending the day and tell my story. Take copies of all your docs and agreements with Efco. (Multiple copies) And the new arrangement from Efco. Yes, get a copy of that too. A broken contract has teeth and consumer fraud will sink their Italian ship.

By the way, it really speaks well of your shop for putting the customer first. Actions like that make me buy another saw from my Dealer just because.

Take care.

 

[Boleclimber]

Is this why "Efco" has changed names so many times through the years.

 

[indiansprings]

Thank you for a good honest post ftom a dealer perspective, before I came involved with a dealer I had a 156 and it was a great saw and highly recommended it, but boy have I learned a different perspective from being behind the counter, Stihl pays like a slot machine, usually get credited same day, two at the most, seldom have to call unless it's tajor. Echo on the other hand is a nightmare to get them to do anything for a customer, it takes forever to get a penny and you better cover your base and call or submit a three page technical write up in my opinion as a Echo dealer their five year warranty isn't worth a shat either, if it wasn't for the fact we have been a Echo dealer 35 years and have tons of string trimmers and blowers out we'd prolly drop the line. You can buy a new echo on ebay cheaper than we can buy them thru our distributor, when asked where they come from they said in the tech meeting two weeks ago they are all stolen units stolen by Home Depot employees,lol.

 

[rheima]

Efco

I was at Menards today and looked at the chain saws they had for sale for fun,and saw several Efcos. I have in the past bought a lot of big ticket items from Menards and big box stores only to be very unhappy if there is problem with the product. The big boxes do not repair or service or have parts for their products that they sell. Go to the manafactuer for parts or repairs they say. I now only go to "Mom and Pop" or smaller sellers with a strong repair and warranty program. Have you noticed the brand names that are for sale at Menards now? Not a familiar brand name among them. Chinese? Kind of like the Maytag/Whirlpool deal now. There are no Newton,Iowa design based real Maytags any more only rebadged Whirlpool products that say Maytag(yes I was a former Maytager of 33 years). I also own a bunch of Macs and a few Stihls and I am really happy with the quality of them! Enough of my rant, buy quality, price is not everything!


Ray

 

[TRIMMER62075]

Lets be fair here



I dont personally think that Efco is being given a fair shake here. I have been dealing with Efco and there great customer service people for a few years now. Warranty is warranty and nothing more and this goes for every manufacturer including but not limited to outdoor power equipment. We all have felt we were done wrong at some point in time but if we look back we often realize that there were rules and regulations that we should have followed. Efco has stepped up several times to help the customer out when the failure/defect fell into a "gray" area. In Efco's defense every manufacturer i deal with put a time frame on when Warranty claims should be filed this normaly being 30 days after the repair is completed. I often see claims that are 60 days old without this causing any problems, if there is a question about the claim who is going to remember something in great detail that is over 2 months old.
Efco does not reject legitimate claims that are filed in the alloted time. I dont know the nature of the claims but given they were legit and filed in a reasonable time frame they would have been payed. The dealer should have followed the guide lines for warranty claims and this would not have been a problem.
Efco is here to stay in the USA as they are developing more products for the US. They are not going away and are growing there dealer network each day. I have over 200 dealers in my five state area that i deal with. There are a lot of smaller dealers included but they are the back bone of the industry. People have grown to love these smaller shops because of there more personal service and attention to detail they often give.
EFco has a 5 year warranty and will stand behind this 100%. Warranty is often confused with guarantee and these are not even close to being the same. Have you ever read any warranty statement from any equipment manufacturer, if you have you know they require a lawyer for interpretation. In short Efco's warranty is fairly simple as well as there warranty policy and procedure. These must be followed in order to get paid no matter the manufacturer.

Lets keep supporting Efco Products
Dont let one bad apple spoil the whole barrel !!!!!!